Dealer Code Decoding Help??

[MikeM]

For my latest 70GS Stage1. White with brown top and saddle interior...

Dealer code: 27-611

For a bit of a mystery car, 70GS Stage1 special order car (body number 001297, production 12C):

Ordering Dealer: 16-008
Reinvoice Dealer: 7-204

Shipping Dealer was 24-389. We traced that already to a CA dealer long out of business. But I'm still curious which dealer ordered it, and which dealer was in the middle. By the time they were done, the car was reduced in price to the shipped to dealer by $95.30 (from $3797.44 to $3702.14). Go figure...

[TXGS]

Here you go Brother!

http://www.buickgsx.net/dealercode.txt

[MikeM]

Thanks... I found my Stage1. Denver Buick. Now off to the internet. Wonder if they are still there.

But nothing about the mystery special order Stage1. I was told that at least one of these codes was a regional office, not a regular dealer. Maybe they both are. There was something funny going on with this car. I won't relate the story here yet, but seeing the dealer codes missing just gives more interesting aspect.

Would anyone know if these are GM branch office numbers?

[Marco]

From my observations only (I'm NOT an expert on this stuff). A re-invoicing means a dealer has a car on their lot that someone else wants.

For example, so I really want a green convertible :laugh: when I walk into a dealership and I'm ready to deal. If the dealer doesn't have one on their lot, and I don't want to wait for it to be built, the dealer can look up my requested options in their 'locator' system to determine if another dealer already has what I want. If found, the car would then be shipped and reinvoiced.

I've seen region office codes look something like xx-00x.

[MikeM]

I called Mike Shaw Buick in Denver. Denver Buick went out of business in 1970. They aren't into supporting the GS or BCA from what they said. Too bad. Nice people and helpful. Maybe my next contact is Denver GSCA. Chances of hitting on someone that knows anything is small, but still worth a try. Thanks for the clue.

[MikeM]

From my observations only (I'm NOT an expert on this stuff). A re-invoicing means a dealer has a car on their lot that someone else wants.

For example, so I really want a green convertible :laugh: when I walk into a dealership and I'm ready to deal. If the dealer doesn't have one on their lot, and I don't want to wait for it to be built, the dealer can look up my requested options in their 'locator' system to determine if another dealer already has what I want. If found, the car would then be shipped and reinvoiced.

I've seen region office codes look something like xx-00x.

So a regional office may have ordered it... 16-008. This is just confirming the weird story I heard behind this car. That it was a promotional 10-10 188 Stage1 fully loaded car (except AC because you couldn't get AC with a Stage2) made in December 1969. And taken aside, painted up like a GSX that wouldn't be made for three months later for photos and promotion. Added Stage2 engine options (eidelbrock, holley, cam that are still on it), less the Stage2 heads that are not on it. And that's where the $95.30 that disappeared to the final dealer also bothers me. The order number was 900002, which I was told means that there were two identical cars ordered this way. That was how the story went. Two cars ordered, for promotions. Supposed to be repainted back to white and all the Stage2 stuff taken back off. But this one got sold before it was put back to stock.

I don't know. But if you say that xx-00x is a region office then this story is more coming together than falling apart.

True or not it is an interesting story and if possible I'd like to know these dealer numbers to see if they shed any more light on the situation.

[TXGS]

Mike Crossing my fingers for you! :TU: sounds like a neat story!

[MikeM]

Here's a list of options you won't see on too many Stage1 cars:

Stage1 Performance option
TH400
full length console
PDB
PS
AM/FM w/rear speaker
white letter tires G60-15 with chrome plated wheels
Rally ride control (rear stabilizer bar, front & rear firm ride springs and rear lower control arm assembly
Forced comfort flo ventilation (no AC)
Custom front and rear seat belts, custom front and rear shoulder belts
Tinted glass
Remote control outside rear view mirror
Carpet savers and handy mats
Power 4 way tilt adjustor drivers side bucket seat
Power windows
Tilt steering wheel
Electric door locks
Convience group - trunk light, mirror map light, instrument gauges and rally clock
Rally steering wheel.

This is in a 10-10 (white) with 188 (black buckets interior) Stage1.

How coincicental is this? And there is nothing special about these options to make it a special order car with a body number like 001297. So something else was going on too. I can't help but to be curious, wouldn't you be.

It still only has 37K miles on it and corrosion is minimal. Just for reference on the condition.

[TXGS]

Something is defenitly quirky about that. Intresting thought I see it is non AC, So have any Idea on the gear ratio? Did it get the good gears?


FYI
My 70 GS 455 4spd. came with

PDB
PS
AC
Rally Gauges and tach
AM radio with rear Speaker
Bucket seats with 4spd console
Performance Axle with posi
Maplight
Lighting group

It is Gulfstream blue with black top and black interior. :beer

[flynbuick]

[QUOTE=TXGS So have any Idea on the gear ratio? Did it get the good gears?

Should have been a code ON 3.64 posi.

[Mike Trom]

Mike,

You might want to contact Brad to see if your car predates his to try and verify the GSX story :Do No: I wonder why they would pick a car with brown interior and vinyl top to paint like a GSX?

As for the dealers:
7-204
Bob Armstrong Buick
Detroit Mich.

24-389
Jim Retzlaff Co,
Barstow, CA

27-611
Denver Buick
Denver, Co.

I do not have a listing for any Buick dealers in zone 16 :Do No: and I have a complete list of zones... As Marco said, the regional codes were less xx-(less than 100). So zone 16 may have been some type of internal Buick billing code :Do No:

Are there any race tracks near the dealers listed above? Maybe the car was promotional and sent to these dealers to "promote" (race) at the local tracks?

As you said, nothing special about the options you listed to make it an SCO car.

:beer

[Duane]

China Mike,
If this car has a build date of "12C" then it does not predate Brad's car.

As far as the SCO, you need to drop the gas tank and look at the "Production Order Body Final" buildsheet. If it's an SCO car it will list the reason at the bottom of the sheet.

In all the hundreds of 70 buildsheets I have decoded I only have 1 SCO sheet, and it was a 70 GS 350 car that came with the G60x15 Goodyear tires with the 15x7 steel rims with the dog dish hub caps and trim rings.
Duane

[MikeM]

A couple clarifications.

The Special Order GS Stage1 was 10-10 188 just like a GSX would have been. I made a little mistake on the build date code, it is 12B (2nd week Dec '69)

I didn't really expect it to predate Brad's car. This was just a few weeks before the real GSXs came out, I was told they arrived in in Feb 1970. It would have been early enough to shoot some photos of what they would look like, as opposed to Brad's car which looks a little different. According to the folklore, the car was not raced. It was supposed to get corrected back to original factory 10-10 white Stage1 without the stripes before it was sold but somehow it "slipped off the lot." The other identical car that was ordered at the same time was returned to white before being sold - or so the story goes.

Naturally I don't know if any of this is true. I'd be curious about the date codes on the "Stage2" Eidelbrock manifold and Holley carb. In fact, I have a couple pics of that if anyone can tell whether these look right for late 1969 versions... There have been a few mods to the car over the years like a driveshaft loop and a few other things.

The current owner does plan to drop the tank but I don't think he's in a big hurry right now. I will ask him to fax me a copy of the build sheet if he finds one. Not sure if he will be so inclined or not.

[Mike Trom]

For my latest 70GS Stage1. White with brown top and saddle interior...

Dealer code: 27-611

For a bit of a mystery car, 70GS Stage1 special order car (body number 001297, production 12C):

Ordering Dealer: 16-008
Reinvoice Dealer: 7-204

Shipping Dealer was 24-389. We traced that already to a CA dealer long out of business. But I'm still curious which dealer ordered it, and which dealer was in the middle. By the time they were done, the car was reduced in price to the shipped to dealer by $95.30 (from $3797.44 to $3702.14). Go figure...

Your first post confused me, I thought you were listing the info for one car and not two :Dou: That is why I questioned the brown top and interior..

:beer

[75Riv]

Thanks... I found my Stage1. Denver Buick. Now off to the internet. Wonder if they are still there.




http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/9548/buickdealerdenver4ai.jpg

[MikeM]

This goes back quite a while ago. A year ago or more I was contacted by someone at the Parts Place (I think) who was planning to buy the 10-10 car which was said to be a GSX publicity car with some Stage2 stuff on it.

I never heard anything more, and was wondering if the car got back from Japan and if anyone can give an update as to what checks out or not about the story of it's background.

I did buy the other one, white stage1 (10-B) with brown top and tan interior which is at Michael Garrison's shop in the final stages of completion.

Can someone from Parts Place, or anyone else, update on this 10-10 Stage1? Does it seem to check out as a promo car? Are the Stg2 parts date coded back to the right time? Just curious...

[Guy Parquette]

Hi Mike,
I just came across this thread.
To answer one of your questions about the correct date of the stage2 parts...well if the carb is a "LIST-4781-2" or just a "LIST-4781", (seen them both ways) that's good for starters. Oh btw, I can't make out the complete numbers from your pictures.
Now, the way the carb looks...it either is an early model (correct) and was rebuilt with a carb kit at one time, or it is a later model (not correct).

The early models were made with a big brass nut and small head for the float adjustment, and the later ones or later rebuild kits were made with the current style needle and seats (float adjusments) which have a smaller steel nut and big screw head.

Also, the car would have had a manual choke cable with knob mounted under the dash...at least that was how car 4085 was built.

The intake looks like the old version...I think. Fast way to tell is if the intake flange is straight across or stepped in the center. Old style was stepped down in the center.

If you could give me more numbers on the carb it would help a bunch:TU:

If this car was for real it would have had the prototype vertical boss heads, which most of them (maybe 8 sets were made) had really bad castings and didn't flow as well on the intake side along with some other problems so I could see why those might be missing.

I do know Engineering GSX car number 4085 was loaned to Public Relations Dept for magazine coverage in the Los Angeles zone sometime just after April 1, 1970...at least that is what the memorandum is dated saying so. But it does not mention another GSX being built with stage2 components.
It does mention the Reynolds car....

Was this car sold?
Thanks for sharing the info, It is an interesting car.

Guy

[Guy Parquette]

This is the one the Parts Place has...looks like the same with a new carb on it. Note the painted intake and painted steel style intake gasket. Most don't do it that way...

Check out the pics in the 1st post...
http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=120985&highlight=fuel+line

[buick64203]

I remember that car. From what I recall it matched up in options to the car in the 1970 Car Craft "Freeway Flier" article. Interesting car. Basically a left handed GSX.