non #'s matching-what's your thoughts?

[mkdgs]

I'm considering a couple of different cars. One is in a little better shape that than other. However, the car that's in better shape has a replacement engine. Does this effect the car's value and if so, how?
Thanks.

[Smartin]

IMO, the only time it effects value is if the buyer is wanting to restore the car to as original as possible...which would mean the need for a #'s matching motor.

Also, people feel more comfortable buying a car with #'s matching because they know how many miles the motor has on it...assuming the speedo was never replaced or messed with.

I know I would feel more comfortable buying a matching car, but if I could drive and take a close look at the condition of the motor, it really wouldn't make a difference whether it was or not.

So, if you're trying to sell it, yeah I think you would get a bigger range of buyers if it was matching. Some folks either don't care, or just don't know what that means.

.02

[Chris Lott]

Post exactly what it is you are looking at, and we can post some opinions. Here's a quick breakdown for you of how important matching #s would be for resale value of a particular car, based on 70-72 A bodies because those are what I know best:

GS Stage-1 : Very important (especially for 70,71)
GS 455 : Somewhat important, although still popular if not
GS 350 : Slightly less important than a GS455
Skylark : Not important at all (not around here anyway)

This is just my opinion and is a generalization. Stage-1s with documentation are still very valueable, but matching #s can be a big percentage of the value. Give some more details...

[D BERRY]

If your buying a car as an investment, or are really concerned about originality of the vehicle then it's critical. If your like me , I can have a much nicer car if I'm not worried about the numbers matching. In fact I wish I had the money to go after Wheelz buddys 72 GSX clone in Flordia, Just remember that everyone has an opinion and you should go the route that you choose.

Dave Berry:TU:

[462CID]

Dave- in some ways, we think very much alike! In one aspect, I can enjoy my non-matching#s clone very much, and in ways a real #s matching GS wouldn't be- my car's a daily driver, and I do not hesitate to drive it and park it in Boston. If any of you have visited my Fair City, you'll know just what I mean by that.

#s matching is great. But in my case, the reality of owning an old car is: I have to replace things, and it is often a choice between replacing things like the engine, or getting rid of the car- I replaced the engine. I found out last year my car is one of 3954, but like Chris said, most people really don't care about low production numbers on a Skylark Custom. If I had known about the low number, I would have kept all my original parts, like the engine and tranny, but I'm not going to regret the route I took, either.

[hemikillerstg1]

When I bought my car, The engine and tranny were long gone. What I looked at is that is was a real GS convertible. That in itself is rare. Rather than put in a 350 with three speed like it left the factory I decided that a 455 and a four speed was what I really wanted. Not original but I intend to drive my car as much as I can. The only reason for having a # matching car is if it is an investment. Probably not a great investment , unless it's Brad's prototype!!!!!!:grin:

Would I love to own a low mile #'s matching Stage one or GS 455 or GSX, Heck Yes, but drive it have fun with it.

When I owned a 69 GTX it was #'s matching, low mile, restored down to every inspection mark and paint daub. I was affriad to drive it when I first got it. Anyway, to make my long winded point, Cars are made to drive. Have FUN :beer

[Marco]

hemikillerstg1 said:...Would I love to own a low mile #'s matching Stage one or GS 455 or GSX, Heck Yes, but drive it have fun with it...

Cars are made to drive. Have FUN :beer

:TU:

[462CID]

You're a brave man, Marco

[Marco]

462CID said:You're a brave man, Marco

Cars are made to be driven and enjoyed :beer

[RANDY TAUSCH]

I do agree that people should drive their cars if that's what they bought them for, but I also think that matching #'s has a big impact on the value of the car if it is a rare and collectible car, whether it is driven or not. There are lots of cars that would not be worth any more money if the #'s match, but on many of our cars, probably 20%-30% of the value is created by the fact that they have matching #'s.
Randy

[Mr Big]

The whole #matching game was started by the Corvette folk....use to own a 69 4sp....and spent several extra thousand dollars putting the original 427 back in the car...just because!

........I lost interest in it shortly there after... couldn’t beat on it!

Had a guy bring me a nice Buick (his moms) and a hand full of cash.

That’s how I got into Buick’s!

Keep the #s engine in the garage and put yer foot in it<grin>:beer

[GS4551970]

I have the original engine to my 70 GS 455. You know where its at? It's sitting in my garage out of the car. I was always afraid of messing it up so i rebuilt another 70 455 out of a Electra and put in it. I have enjoyed the car so much more now.So in my opinion # dont matter. Its nice knowing i have the original motor but it will probably never go back into the car.There again just depends on what your intentions are for the car and how you want to drive it.

[71GS455]

I agree with Adam M,

The value of #'s matching is most important to someone who would want to restore the car as original as possible.

Having a #'s matching 71 GS455 I feel a certain responsibility to not doing things to it that can't be "undone". As a result, I'm not going to be making this car into a race car. In fact I've currently got it listed on ebay and have had a few inquiries regarding it being numbers matching.

One person is currently doing a frame-off on a 1971 Stage 1 that's a #'s car. I'm assuming that if he is to buy mine, that he would do the same thing.

But if you're looking for a driver, or especially something to do some drag racing with, it's almost better to find a car that isn't #'s matching. It brings the price down along with not worrying about putting a window in the block.

Another thing you could do is pull the #'s motor and build a spare for the track, as was also mentioned. My biggest fear with that is that sometimes "stuff" happens and after being separated the parts never get back together, and worse they go different directions!

I would rather find a GS350 or a Skylark and build it up for that purpose.

[Mr Big]

When I found my Stage 1, it had a race engine in it....still does, but one of the reasons I bought this perticular car was that it came with the entire matching # drivetrain...engine/trans/and rear....I am currently looking for a body/project for the race drivetrain...I'll then put the car back the way it came....I'll still drive it...just wont be doing any 6000rpm burn outs<grin>:beer

[RATROASTER]

A 455 that is not #'s matching is way better than a #'s matching 350 anyday!! Leave the #'s matching 350's for the Cheby guys!!

[john campbell]

the way i see it unless you want a show car #s matching really dont matter, when i went out years ago looking for a GS i wanted #s matching and i found it but as i started fixing it up i felt my options were limited because of the matching #s. now when i get it say painted i feel i have to paint it its original color to keep it #s matching even though i would prefer a different color, or say i decide i want a 4 speed i feel it would be wrong to take out the matching #s automatic. so in one way i can say yeah my car is a matching #s stage 1, but on the other hand i feel i'm limited to what i can do with it. so i say decide before hand what you want the car for, do you want a daily driver, drag racer, show car?

[gstewart]

number matching usually is an indication that vehicle had decent care in its history . it also increases the value of the vehicle .
i all depends on what u have the vehicle for . my car is ##s matching & i would not modify it by installing a 4 sp + associated parts . i prefer to retain & maintain the history of the car .

[Yardley]

GS4551970 said:I have the original engine to my 70 GS 455. You know where its at? It's sitting in my garage out of the car. I was always afraid of messing it up so i rebuilt another 70 455 out of a Electra and put in it. I have enjoyed the car so much more now.So in my opinion # dont matter. Its nice knowing i have the original motor but it will probably never go back into the car.There again just depends on what your intentions are for the car and how you want to drive it.

I have the same sitch Kevin. My #s matching engine is sitting in my garage and unless I grenade the 455, the 430 will never see the light of day.

It was rebuilt way before I got it, and after I did a rebuild on it the serial # was machined off the deck of the block. I know it is the numbers matching block, but how would I ever convince someone else of it?

I think a non-numbers drivetrain in a REAL GS, SS, GTO, 442 is more important than a numbers matching drivetrain in a clone. But if you don't have the real McCoy, a clone is fine (just please don't try passing it off as the real thing. If nobody asks, then don't tell, but if they ask then either side step it or come clean).

[Chris Lott]

Just surprised the original poster (Mark) hasn't replied back yet to say which cars he is looking at. I would be curious to know. Jeff, I agree. Clones are fine, but don't pass them off as the real thing. That has to be one of my biggest pet peeves.

[Yardley]

Chris Lott said:Jeff, I agree. Clones are fine, but don't pass them off as the real thing. That has to be one of my biggest pet peeves.

Absolutely. That's why my signature even claims "clone". Now, if you don't ask, I won't tell...

[mkdgs]

Thanks to all who posted their opinions. When you talk #'s matching to the owner of the car you're interested in possibly buying, the reply is skewed in the direction of their car:Do No: .
So it's good to hear from people who have no vested interest in replying to my post & will give an honest answer. Much appreciated!:beer
As for the kind of car I'm looking for or considering, it's between a GS or possibly a Trans Am (I know, I know!)
So once again, thanks much for your opinions. MUCH appreciated!