4 speed swap-70-For F sake

[moleary]

Most of you know me, but part of the healing process is to come out and say...My name is Mark and I am a gearaholic...

Group meetings are not helping, a recent temptation has me off the wagon and in the ditch. There is only one thing I need to cure this....parts.

I really prefer to find a seller who has most, if not all, of the parts for this mission; a package. Must be 70 Specific.

Thanks.

[moleary]

I have a possible deal on a solid base of parts:TU: , but, I would still like to find a seller that can furnish most all of it in one deal for a swap from A/T to M/T. 1970 GS correct parts where required, and is preferred for as much of it as I can find, however, proper functioning interhangable incorrect vintage is ok too.

New aftermarket Garrison parts is also option to fill in for OEM parts where possible.

Thanks,

[moleary]

:beers2: ugh

[Joe65SkylarkGS]

We are here today to let you know how much we all love you. We can't stand by and let you slowly kill yourself.







































































(Intervention):Brow:

[painekiller]

get ahold of my Dad, Greatscat he just bought a 68 GS 400 4 speed that i think will be parted out.

[moleary]

Thanks for your concern Joe; this is quite a monkey on my back I just choose to wallow in it's missery:laugh: Got any parts, man?




We are here today to let you know how much we all love you. We can't stand by and let you slowly kill yourself.







































































(Intervention):Brow:

[moleary]

Thanks Doug, I saw that and got quite excited but presumed the parts were vamped up already? I will contact him. MarkO



get ahold of my Dad, Greatscat he just bought a 68 GS 400 4 speed that i think will be parted out.

[wheelz]

MarkO...FYI, the 68 4 speed setup doesn't utilize the backdrive steering lockout mechanism! THAT system began in 69. SO just remember that tidbit when looking for 70 specific 4 speed setup. :beers2: Wheelz, Tampa Bay

[moleary]

10-4. as I said, I prefer 70 correct, but would consider otherwise so long as functional. I have a lead on the 70 parts but can't seem to close the deal :puzzled:

[Joe65SkylarkGS]

Nah, I don't have any 4 speed stuff. The resto i'm doing now is my first 4 speed.

And I know ours are totally different.

I will keep my ears open.

[MGSCP]

MarkO...FYI, the 68 4 speed setup doesn't utilize the backdrive steering lockout mechanism! THAT system began in 69. SO just remember that tidbit when looking for 70 specific 4 speed setup. :beers2: Wheelz, Tampa Bay


:idea2: Also 69 backdrive is different from 70-72

[greatscat]

MarkO...FYI, the 68 4 speed setup doesn't utilize the backdrive steering lockout mechanism! THAT system began in 69. SO just remember that tidbit when looking for 70 specific 4 speed setup. :beers2: Wheelz, Tampa Bay
Thanks for posting the info Wheelz.
gary

[marxjunk]

RACEBUICKS had a back drive he reproduced, if you go to the repro section he has pics listed.,..nice stuff....some 68 stuff+repro stuff=gotter done

[moleary]

Not that anyone really gives a rats arse, but I played hookey today and planned for an ALL BUICK weekend. I worked to arrange that all the parts would be here by today. It did not quite work out but enough showed this week to keep me out of the tavern. Demo last weekend has the car all ready for it's next life...

All I am waiting on now are clutch parts and shifter linkage. Next weekend it will be on the road.

Today I restoed an SFI bellhousing and a butchered block plate. Bought new grade 8 hardware for it. That now looks like a car part, was dry fit it with the trans and I measured for driveline. Damn, my beefy driveline I had is going to be an inch short, what's another $300:moonu:

I restored the BB steering shaft I yarded from the 68 GS 400 I deboned a while back and when the steering column is ready to go in, it will too.

I removed the dry fit bell housing and trans, mounted pedals and cut floor opening. [PIC]

There is an issue with the steering column that arrived today.http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=174661 It will take some work tomorrow and hopefully resolved and installed tomorrow.

Any down time from the trans job will be spent installing the SUMMIT rear control arm braces and the power windows. I will also get the M/T speedo in the instrument panel and button the dash up.

The Parts Place boned me today with the speedo cable and fire wall boot which was promised to be here today. Long story short; crappy customer service.

New carpet and Dynamat showed up. New door panels are next to finish it all off just needing paint and a top some day:TU:



:beers2:

[moleary]

Not too much head way as some other stuff popped up this weekend beyond my control keeping me out of the shop.

Got the dash backk together with the M/T speedo, and did a little tidying up of some wires.

Installed the dynamat.

Next weekend should be a good gain on it.

[moleary]

I only spent about 2hrs on the project.

Last weekend since I didn't have all the parts to build on, I dry fit the SFI bellhousing and the trans to measure for driveline length. (The car has a built Chevy 12 bolt rear) The driveline was built 1.5 years ago and for whatever reason was 1/2" too short, and I have been running it in the SP TH 400 as is without issue). I decided since I am going all in, do it just right for this project. I dropped the driveline off with my pals at Driveline NW and they took care of me last week.

I took a few minutes to inventory parts and snap a couple pics for the record. I see I don't have a clutch return spring; I will resolve this coming week. I will store the factory aluminum bellhousing, boot and inspection cover for now as I feel better with the Lakewood SFI Steel set up.

This weekend with limited time, here is the progress report.

I prepared and installed pilot bushing. Mic indicated solid .001" too tight for the crank even with 2 days frozen bushing (1.093" frozen). I Took emery cloth wrapped around a socket and a few spins with the gun in the crank hole (previously measured for concectric bore). I was careful to not over do it. I cleaned up bore and pounded it in just right with a little 30W oil on the bushing and a blast of WD-40 after it was started. It is a bit un-nerving beating on the end of the crank (thrust) but you get a feeling if it is right or not. If you do not have the proper bearing install tool set, use caution pounding the bushing in. Just a RPH past flush.
Next, I the set block plate, installed the fly wheel, cleaned surface with brakeleen, and installed clutch assy. Follow clutch instructions carefully, tighten / torque the clutch pressure plate properly to the flyweel. Use alignment tool this step! Flywheel to crank torque spec is 60 ft.lb and clutch to flywheel is 30-40 ft.lb torque.
Install fork and Lakewood Bell housing.
Install ball stud in block. (It helps to chase these threads previosly.) With engine in place, limited but accessible with the 3/8" open end.
That is all under car time allows today.
I took a few minutes to install an OEM Neutral Safety Switch.
Next weekend should be all done. I still have issue with the steering column. Must resolve this week to have on the raod next weekend.

See you next week. MO

[Topcat]

Looking good MarkO :TU:

I love all the gearhead Buick photo's.........get-er-done !

Peace WildBill

[Lee Bacon]

You just wait Mark!!!! 4-speed in a ragtop!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:3gears: :3gears: :3gears: :TU:

[moleary]

"Weekend Update" for those who care and those that really don't:bla:

A Minor set back from completing the project this weekend as I discovered my M-20 is a '68 unit so it does not support the '70 linkage levers (I have). I will need to replace the 68's for a set of 70's; I hope to have the parts this coming week.

I poked at a few things this weekend.

I took the time to realign the body to the frame which was off by 1/4 at the front favoring the passenger side. I did not check that close when I put the body back on the rebuilt frame years ago:Dou: I figured now with the Manual Trans, the body alignment is a bit more crucial. I needed to remove inner fenders for that task of course to get to the body bushing nuts that live in the torque boxes. While the inners were out, it made for good opportunity to tack two of the press in nuts back on:TU: Pass side all back together, but I left the driver side out for easier access until I get the swap done. It is was nice for the other projects I had going on too.

One item off the list is I changed to BBB steering shaft that I picked out of the 68 GS 400 a few months ago. It was blasted and painted of course.

I restored the tilt floor shift column, installed with the clutch linkage boot. Sure looks perty in there:beers2:

I installed the Z bar frame bracket, Z bar, cluth likage rod and fork, ready for the trans install next Friday. I will finish the grade 8 bolts all the way around the bell housing before installing the trans.:TU:

For reference for those who are planning a swap, simply remove the dust shield on the frame / innner fender and there is just enough access to install / retro fit the Z bar frame bracket and access for Z bar install. The holes are already punched int he frame. I posted a pic of that before I removed the inner for my other projects.

I Prepped and welded the floor hump in , seam sealed both in and out and coated under side. Final trim of the hump for shifter opening after tanny is installed to get it just right.

I installed the speedo cable and new firewall grommet and connected the dash side. I plan to fab a couple of the speedo cable clips as I do not think anyone repops; I will check Cheby sites first since most everything is popped for Cheby's:rolleyes:

I finished today swapping the rear quarter power windows.

Maybe I will have it ready for an Easter Sunday Ride:beers2:

Off to the grill to get the London Broil on point and a few cocktails:beers2:

[Lee Bacon]

Hey Mark show me a pic of what your talking about on the linkage. Lee:confused:

[moleary]

...my 68 M-20 has threaded studs coming out of the side cover to mount likage levers onto that operate the shift forks inside the trans. The 70 uses studs that thread into the trany; only really a problem on the 3rd gear lever as the reverse lockout linkage utilize a longer stud. I attached a pic of a correct 70 from the u shift em forum.

[Lee Bacon]

OK:3gears:

[moleary]

I got my butt kicked today.

I have been fighting clutch z-bar / fork geometry. I decided to remove the Lakewood bell housing set up which entails complete dissasebly of the clutch and removal of fly wheel to get the block plate off, and installed the stock bellhousing, reinstalled the flywheel and clutch to see if there was a issue with the Lakewood, but it is still f'd up. I am at a loss on this. It seems like the z bar is too short:Do No:

The tranny parts for the linkage lever swap did not show up today for some reason,so I decided to install trans and hope to swap the shift fork inserts in place. It looks possible but not fun. I think I will wait to re-install the trans again until I switch these out on the bench as the trans would not go in either and has to come out anyway.

Trans is not going home, perhaps a pilot bushing issue, but not sure as alignment tool goes home:Do No: I will pull trans back out and do some investigation.

Enough for this weekend.

[wheelz]

Hey Mark..I rec'd your call yesterday but I got tied up and forgot to call you back, SORRY. Reading your post...is it possible you COULD HAVE a 350 "Z" bar? instead of a 455 "Z" bar? OR the "clutch fork push-rod" maybe the wrong one too!?!? ...and also, experience tells me that you really need to lower the back of the engine "quite a bit" to allow up-&-down "wiggle and alignment" of the tranny pilot shaft when installing it... the tailshaft end of the tranny seems to NEED TO go higher than you think to make it slide in. Been there a few times and thats what I've found works. If you need to ..call me later this morning..I'll be running around doin saturday chores and I'll have my phone! :beers2: Wheelz, Tampa Bay

[moleary]

I am thinking the clutch rod / fork geometry is wrong due to the deep throwout bearing that came with the clutch:Do No:

[Lee Bacon]

Mark wheelz is right. My exp. has been that every time I try to use the roller pilot bushing I just fight it. :confused: So i just buy the bronze one & it fit's every time! Just my experiance. :TU:

[moleary]

I installed the bronze pilot bushing.

[Lee Bacon]

Sorry Mark in one of your pic's I thought it was the pilot bushing:Dou: It will go in it's just that when your lifting it you have to get it just right. I layed under the tran's & just lifted it till it slipped right in. Kind of precision you know. Wish I was there to help:Brow:

[moleary]

:mad: not much progress expected AGAIN this weekend on the stick job,:rant: the parts for the tranny failed to show up again :af:

The pilot bushing is now correct ID". I fabbed up a couple speedo cable clips:boring:

Maybe next weekend :3gears:

[wheelz]

Mark... Didja reach Dennis @ DME?:Do No: Wheelz, Tampa Bay

[moleary]

Hi Dennis, I wish I had, but no, not for these parts as I already had someone sending me the parts and it is taking longer than need be...I will for anything else I need though:TU:

[moleary]

I plan to rest and hang with the family today (Sunday), so this is this weekend's progress report- for those who care:

FRIDAY- played hookey again. I finally got the shift shafts to swap in for the 70 linkage set up. Upon doing so, I discovered that the scabby (E-bay) dog who sold me the "rebuilt trans" failed to replace the worn reverse gears :rant: By the looks of the speedo gear, it was ameture hour rebuild. The rest of the trans is fresh. I discovered the gear issue in time Friday to find a new set in Seattle. ($200) and a speedo gear ($40) so I was not dead in the water over the weekend. I outsmarted myself this time- I set the new speedo gear on the hallogen shop light while fussing with the the other gears and it heated up nicely to expand it so I just slid it on by gloved hand over the output shaft :Brow: TIP: Be quick here though to get it to it's correct location because that puppy cooled quick and gripped onto that shaft in seconds.

I sand blasted the Lakewood bellhousing and block plate and refinished them, put in storage for now.

Power windows are almost in. Pass Driver's door is done and hung. I replaced the hinge bushings :TU: Rear Q's windows are done. Wires are run complete less passenger door, which needs to be removed, holes drilled, etc.

SATURDAY: SO, trans is now in good shape now. I fit the linkage and shifter; all good! Reinstalled the clutch and decided to re-assemble the car with the factory style bellhousing just to get the car working correctly.

Road trip to painter man's shop about 1 hr away to pick up the fresh body parts. Re-assembled rear spoiler to deck lid, and sport mirrors; hung them and hood. Very nice indeed.

Trans is ready to go in now, but out of time for this weekend, kids. See you next weekend where we try to button up the trans swap project, the power windows, and get the interior back together test drive - weather permitting.

[Lee Bacon]

Nice Mark, glad it's finally coming together!!!! WHEW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :3gears:

[moleary]

Now that picture would bring a tear to a glass eye :beers2:

Not a bad day at all. Tranny installed and filled with Redline GL-4, final trim on tunnel hump for shifter fit, all linkage and clutch connected, crossmember and fresh driveline installed, shifter boot and trim ring installed and the carpet kit was fit.

I also continued with the power window install and hopefully tomorrow I can have it all back together.

It is supposed to continue raining so no test drive tomorrow; plan to adjust clutch, continue power windows and perhaps start the front bench rebuild / recovering project :beers2:

Off to dinner with the lovely wife and cocktails!

[glen roberts]

Looks good Mark

[moleary]

Thanks Glen, I hope it all works as good as it looks.

[moleary]

:3gears: all done. The weather has been sunny and beautiful. Been out test driving, everything seem s ok so far..:3gears:

[moleary]

Time for an update: so far so good. :pray:

I have put about 100 +/- miles ( 8 +/- hours) on it over the past couple weeks, laid into it plenty, and everything seems ok thus far. I have stayed on the Island pretty much and only strayed off once about 10 miles from home. It’s a blast to drive! The car definitely is not as “smooth” as the hydro-matic, but definitely is a kick in the pants to drive :3gears:

For the most part, it shifts smoothly, but I still do not think everything is 100% perfect in the bell crank / clutch-rod geometry department. I slotted the frame bracket a little bit to allow it to line up better which helped tremendously. I don't think there is an issue with motor mounts so I have not replaced them yet.

Last weekend I swapped back to the factory Ralleys with the 245/60/15 because I just do not like the look of anything but a factory Ralleys. Needless to say, looks sharp, but not enough tire, and too hard of a compound. It will wheel hop now, but, I have not yet installed the trailing arm frame braces.

This weekend will allow for plenty more “test” time.

[moleary]

What a great week with the weather in the 80's. I took the beast to work Wednesday and Thursday to give it some road rash in the big city and all went great. I put new hides on today so traction is now somewhat attainable in second and third if I don't mash it and it just loves shifting as it bounces off the rev limiter set at 6K rpm. What a ride.

[Rick Henderson]

Mark,
How is the car doing now? Can you tell me about the results of the dynomat install and if it really helped out much? Did you install any of the sound blocker?

[moleary]

Hi Rick, I only installed the mat as the pics show, and realized substantial noise reduction. I tend to think the vehicle stays cooler also.

Car still rips through the gears just fine, thanks! There is just nothing like rowing the gears on a Big Block Rag Top BUICK. I cant wait to put an OD trans in there like someone I know.....:beer.

I talked with DK today; I'll call you as I would love to see DJ's car...

Talk soon. MO

[flynbuick]

Did you consider a Lakewood adjustable pivot ball?

[moleary]

Hey Jim, yes, the bellhousing did have the adjustable ball and I did actually get it all set up, but, since Lakewood can not figure out to make a boot for the fork, I opted to remove it all and sell that scatter shield set up to Herb and stuck with factory set up as I will not be drag racing this car....