I need some advice on what needs to be spelled out in a paint and bodywork conctract. This is for my 1970 Stage1 4speed car. I'm wanting a show quality paint job in it's original color of Burgundy Mist. I haven't had a car painted in over 16 years and that experience wasn't pretty. I want this car done without issues, so any help would be appreciated. Kraig
Give me a call here and I can tell you how we do it at least. I can also tell you what to look out for. Sean 603-749-7536
Body work is a big unknown until you get the paint off. Because Burgundy Mist is a dark color you'll need to factor in a bit more surface prep than a screaming yellow. There are 2 factors that you need to work out with the shop. Time and Money. Time refers to when your project will be complete. You want the project done quickly but not shoddy. The shop wants to know the scale of the project. Money is always a factor. You want good value for your money, the shop wants to know they'll get paid. If you run out of money the shop is stuck with a half finished project cluttering the shop. Assurances that you have the funds available has value to them. What you want in the contract is an agreed upon price and completion date. The shop won't want to agree to those because it's almost impossible to properly estimate what it will cost (in time or money) until the paint is off. The best you can do is to make sure the project does not stall, and only work you authorize is done. I recently had a ton of work done on my car and was very pleased with the outcome. Money: We agreed on an hourly rate. I paid a deposit to get the project started and I paid the hourly rate as the project unfolded. Time: As issues came up I could go with a cheap fix or authorize more time to do it right. That left the choice in my hands. I received regular updates (email with pictures) so I could be assured the project was progressing. The shop encouraged me to stop by whenever I wanted and I did several times. I think the best you can ask for in a contract is to outline the rules for how you'll get through the project. Good luck, and post pictures! John
Here is what I did: 1. WHAT will be done. Very specifically in terms of body preparation, repairs, materials used, parts used, and all details that describe the items above 2. WHO will do the work. Specifically, is the work done in house? Is anything outsourced? 3. WHEN it will be done. Specific milestones of progress, like: Body stripped, rust repairs complete, primer applied, etc. 4. QUALITY - This needs to be described in detail in regard to the level of quality. 5. DEVIATIONS - When the shop needs to do more work over and above the list above, you need to have a contingency that describes how the extra work will be handled. labor rates, parts, etc. need to be spelled out. Owner must sign off BEFORE a deviation is made. 6. PROTECTION - The car will be stored inside at all times. The parts removed will be inventoried and stored safely inside. The car will not leave the premises unless the owner is contacted. 7. COST SAFETY NET - You need to determine a "Not to Exceed" cost for each of the major milestones. It is nice to have a son in law school........:laugh: Draw up a contract, and have the shop owner sign it. NEVER EVER do a verbal contract!!!!!!
Paul, and others, Did you have any difficulty getting the body shop to sign the contract? I can easily picture that any body shop which is good enough for me to want them to do the work, probably has enough of a backlog of cars without contracts that they're willing to walk away from some anal customer (me) who walks in with a contract. Ironically, this is also the type of shop for which you probably don't need a contract. Conversely, a shop desperate for work may grudgingly sign a contract, but I'm not sure it will do you much good if troubles arise. A contract isn't going to make your paint shinier, nor magically transform a poor time-manager into an ace project manager. I'm not trying to discourage use of a contract; if nothing else, it nails down -- up front -- expectations for both sides. But I'm just thinking that good recommendations from satisfied customers may be worth a lot more than a signed contract. Thoughts?
I am in negotiation for the paint and body on my 72 Stage 1 Suncoupe . To avoid the oold well we found this and that crap . I had the car media blasted before the body shop . The problem as I see it is choosing whom you think will not screw you or at least screw you the least . I am using recomendations for my main decision maker . I have one that has done resto work for years and is at 45 per hour . He has many satisfied and repeat customers . I have another thats 30 miles closer that has a regular body shop that is doing 1 resto project at a time . He's at 50 per hour and I can check on it often . I am only having the panel fitting body work and paint done reassembly will be at my house . I am considering having the car painted and not sanded or cleared until I have the majority of the assembly complete . I feel that way if I screw something up it can be fixed easily . I have yet to pick up my car from the media blaster but its to be done today and there is no way I am driving in slush and salt with an open trailer witha primered car . John
Kraig, You saw the pics on our site for the 70 Stg1 conv I just finished. That paint work ran $6000. Shop rate is $50/hr. The most time is spent on block sanding. Panel fitment time was minimal. All metal work was done by me. I don't know what your budget is for your car but you will not be able to do a car for less than $2500-3000. Material costs have doubled or tripled in the last 5-7 years. Kemper, As for leaving the car in base coat then reassembly.....I think you will introduce too many contaminants into the base coat before clearing it. If the shop is good...they can assemble the entire body and do all the jamb painting before assembly. Once they assemble the car, paint and clear it, you can assemble it. There is really no chance for you to scratch the new paint unless something unforseen happens (branch falls on the car or you drop something on it.) Just use good quality shipping quilts to cover the areas where you will be working and you won't have a problem.
I understand , if I use my space heater it might make the clear not adhere to the base coat ? I probably will have to mount my body to the correct frame before paint . I guess that will have to be wrapped . I am having the frame powder coated in semi gloss . I am picking it up tomorrow Any suggestions as to wrapping the frame ?
You can use the regular wax-type paper to wrap the frame. Most body shops have it.....it is a blue colored paper. You can also use large rolls of plastic wrap which will probably be easier and quicker. You can get this from any local shipping store.....or www.uline.com It works great.
Hi Guys Just Checking Out This Issue. The Way I Run My Shop Is Straight Forward And No B.s. I Look At The Customers Car (in Whatever Condition,primed,bare Oe Paint Etc.) I Get The Customer To Tell Me Exactly What He Wants All The Way Down To The Littlest Thing,i Then Bid The Project Not (i Repeat) Not An Hourly Rate And About ????how Mutch Time It Will Take. I Only Do Resto And Classic Work ,no Colision Or Late Model Stuff,the Way I Look At It,if I Cant Look A Car Over And No Exactly What Its Going To Take To Get The Reults The Owner Wants I Shouldnt Be Doing This Kind Of Work Period!!!!! And If I Quote A Price I Will Absolutly Not Be Calling The Customer After Its A Part (and The Customer Is In A Catch 22) And Say,man This Car Needs More Thatn I Thought Now I Nedd $$$$$ This Mutch More ,or Get The Car Done And Its ????? As To The Quality And The Customer Comes To Get It And I Say ....well You Only Wanted To Spend X Amount Of Money And Thats What You Get For That Cash!!!!! Thats Total B.s And It Happens On A Daily Basis To People. If I Bid A Car And It Needs More Time,materials,etc I Eat It!!! And The Customer Gets Exactly What We Agreed Apon . And If A Shop Is Reputalble And Wants Repeat Customers Thats How It Should Be,and They Sjould Have Enough Knowledge About The Car There Working On To Give A Flate Price On The Job,if They Hit You With An Hourly Rate Keep Looking (my Opionion). Every One Has A Job,there Are Days When We All Go Into Work And We Just Dont Give 100%,if I Put In 8hours On A Customers Car And It Should Have Only Taken Me 4 Or 5 Is That Realy Fair To Be Charging The Customer 8 Hrs????? As For As Time Of Completion,again I Know What My Shop Is Capable Of,i Know What Work I Have Now,whats Coming Etc. So Again I Should Know When A Car Would Be Finished For Pick Up And I Give Myself An Extra Time Alowance For Set Backs. So When I Tell A Customer Its Going To Be X Amount Of Time Iam Usualy Under My Time Alowed By Weeks If Not Months. Contracts.....every Thing The Customer Wants Done,and How He Expects The Car To Be When He Gets It Back Is On My Invoice,if The Customer Adds Work During The Project It Gets Added To The Invoice In Deatail And Any Addtional Price Or Parts Are Added At The Same Time (if A Customer Wants Say Somthing Small Added Most Of The Time Ill Do It At N/c). My Goal Is To Make The Customer 100% Satisfied With My Work,1 Bad Job Will Lose Me 4,i Dont Do Any Paid Advertisment And 95% Of My Work Comes From Word Of Mouth,or From Cars Iv Showed In Competition. Thats Just My Opionion On This Subject And Thats How I Run My Shop. Thanks Customd
PS,IV BEEN TOLD MY WEB PAGE LINK WASNT WORKING,HERE IS AN UPDATED LINK THANKS CUSTOMD http://community-2.webtv.net/CUSTOMD/CUSTOMDSXTREMCARS/
Also,to Awnser Johns Question,when You Shoot Base /clear You Only Have A Window (each Paint Manufactures Is Diffrent) In Geting The Clear On It,or You Have To Scuff, Re Base (at Least One Full Coat) Then Clear It. They Do Make An Interclear (usaly Used During Multiple Graphics Over Base) But I Dont Recomend This On A Full Paint Job. I Use Dupont And I Make Sure The Clear Is On The Base No Less Than 4 Hours After The Base Is Shot In Order To Promote A Godd Adheasion. I Just Did A Bid On A 40 Ford Street Rod Where The Shop Painted The Car Tangilo Pearl. Which Is A Multi Stage Paint Job.....white Base Then The Pearl Orange Then The Clear. Its A Very Very Long Time In The Booth To Spray This Set Up. So They Shot The White One Day,came The Next And Shot The Pearl,then Cleard It On The Third,put The Complete Car Back Together And The First Time The Guy Washed The Car The Paint Came Off In Sheets.....no Adheasion To Each Coat Because Of The To Long Of Period.mind You This Was A Complete Runing Driving Car Ready For The Shows And It Had To Be Taken Completly Apart Striped Back To Raw And Re Done. The Shop Said It Would Re Do The Car At No Charge!!!! But If They Didnt Do It Right The First Time????? Your Best Bet Would Be To Paint The Car Completely In Pieces (thats How We Shoot All Of Our Cars) Then Re Asseymble It. You Also Dont Want The Body On A Difrent Chassise When Doing The Body Work,it Needs To Be On The Frame Your Going To Use And Bolted Down,then You Can Pull It Off And Do Your Paint Work And Then Re Assymble It. If You Havnt Put A Freshly Painted Car Back Together Before You May Want A Reputable Shop To Do It (and My Wife Keeps Asking Me When Im Gona Stop Smoking Lol). Customd
