Ede 800 AVS2 or Holley 870 Street Avenger on 364 nailhead?

Discussion in ''Da Nailhead' started by JayZee88, Apr 18, 2020.

  1. JayZee88

    JayZee88 Well-Known Member

    I am starting to think about what to do to the 364 in my 58 Special. Ive read that (like all Buick V8s) they love big carbs. I am searching for a 4 barrel intake and which carb to use. I thought about the Holley 870 street avenger but also the Edelbrock 800 AVS2. Most big nailhead guys tend to lean to Edelbrock and they are easier to fine tune for specific combinations. Since my 364 is mostly apart im thinking of a mild performer TA cam, roller timing chain, headers, and docs intake modification. I am leaning toward a 350-400hp build, but unsure which way to lean on the carb.
     
  2. gsgtx

    gsgtx Silver Level contributor

    the avs2 is way better than the older edelbrock ones. on a 364 i would go with a avs2 650. better off line and low and mid range the the 800 might out perform it after 5000 rpms if thats what you need.
     
  3. No Lift

    No Lift Platinum Level Contributor

    I would agree on the AVS because it should bolt right up to the stock intake with no adapter. I don't really think you need a 800 on a 364 and as mentioned response will be better. One problem you may run into with the 800 is the throttle bores may be larger than the factory intake bores which may require them to be opened up. For that matter I'd check the 650 bore before bolting it up. When I raced my 401 it did not like a Holley bolted up with an adapter compared to the factory Carter.
     
  4. JayZee88

    JayZee88 Well-Known Member

    Im using a 1 in cloverleaf spacer. I will open it up where needed. I want more mid range with high rpm potential. I am doing stage 1 springs, etc so it can make most out it's potential. Hood clearance isn't a issue cause of a hood mounted breather I'm putting on it.
     
  5. Many people's experience has shown that nailheads like a bigger than normal carburetor. An Edelbrock 750 afb would be a great performer on that 364. With a 650 you're just leaving performance on the table.
     
    Bigpig455 likes this.
  6. DEADMANSCURVE

    DEADMANSCURVE my first word : truck

    I was just gonna chime in on something but you mentioned using the spacer .
    but FYI for anyone listening - the 800AVS throttle blades did not clear the opening on my performer intake . oem cast probably no way . had to use an 850 spacer to test run the carb , 750 spacer not quite big enough . I would guess the 870 street avenger may be the same , redid one of those awhile back , can't remember if I tested that or not . .
     
  7. LARRY70GS

    LARRY70GS a.k.a. "THE WIZARD" Staff Member

    I would choose an AVS carburetor over the AFB if you are buying new. The AVS has an adjustable air valve sort of like a Q-jet. The AFB uses a counter weighted air valve which is not adjustable.
     
  8. gsgtx

    gsgtx Silver Level contributor

    they have a avs but the avs2 is all new with annular primary boosters, helps off idle hesitation which some guys use to complain about. you can adjust the afb carb by grinding down or adding weight but myself never had a problem with the flap.
     
    wkillgs and (deleted member) like this.
  9. telriv

    telriv Founders Club Member

    The rear secondary air flap only opens as much as air demand is required. Chassis dyno testing revealed even at WOT when the air flaps were moved while the throttle was held to wide open there was NO HP or Torque increase & resulted in a split second hesitation when opened.
     
  10. JayZee88

    JayZee88 Well-Known Member

    Telriv are you talking about the older AFB or AVS2? Has anyone had experience with the Holley Street Avenger series carbs?
     
  11. LARRY70GS

    LARRY70GS a.k.a. "THE WIZARD" Staff Member

    A Holley vacuum secondary carburetor is possibly the worst carburetor to use on a 67-76 400-430-455. You are much better off with a Double pumper. Not sure about the Nailhead.
     
    JayZee88 likes this.
  12. JayZee88

    JayZee88 Well-Known Member

    Thank You guys for your insight. For going with the tried and true I decided to stick with a Edelbrock. I have heard many folks say good things about the AVS2 and want to give it a try. I am going to get a 4 hole spacer and modify it to fit with Docs intake mod.
     
    Reidk likes this.
  13. gsgtx

    gsgtx Silver Level contributor

    Larry, you will get a kick out of this i know you like Q-jet. this is why i was asking about the 3-hole gasket on 4-hole intake yesterday on the 455 thread. just get in a few hours ago from a test drive. 1967 442 400 cubic inch 4-speed. seems like a stock engine, just got the car not long ago. came with a holley 650 cfm replacement for a q-jet. owner set me the stock rebuilt Q-jet carb that i put on today. holley ran alright vacuum secondary. put q-jet on idle seem smoother, ran a little nicer, power wise it just wasnt there way less power after 4000-4500 rpms. thinking q-jets are junk.got home check the secondary was locked out, rod was hitting the air cleaner base riser i put on, so just moved the riser to clear the rod there was a notch in the riser. test drive oh yea pulled better then the 650 holley all through the rpms. sorry for the long story :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2020
    Reidk, Bigpig455 and LARRY70GS like this.
  14. Dragdoc

    Dragdoc Well-Known Member

    I am just a day or two away from firing up my 364 with a new 800cfm AVS 2.

    Wont be able to compare to old set up because the car went from a 2bbl, single exhaust and dynaflow to the 4bbl, dual exhaust and a switch pitch 400. Will feel like a totally different car!
     
    JayZee88 likes this.
  15. telriv

    telriv Founders Club Member

    I have had 750 Holley double pumper on my '64 Riv. since about 1975 or so. Everyone said it wouldn't work on a big heavy car. Of course I had to satisfy my own curiosity. Took of the big accelerator pump squirters & replaced with the smaller ones. Had to do some carb. tuning as far as jets & power valves. Got it all dialed in & then added an electric choke.. MANY said you can't do that also, BUT I did & it works flawlessly.
    Gets me decent MPG IF I can keep my foot out of it & has been rebuilt twice since '75. Time for another.
    Works well enough to every so often when conditions are right it will pull the left front. I stopped racing it because I was starting to see the affects of body/frame twist & the resulting cracking that goes along with it.

    Tom T.
     
    Max Damage and JayZee88 like this.
  16. JayZee88

    JayZee88 Well-Known Member

    How did the avs2 perform on your car? Have to adjust anything or did it work good out of the box?


     
  17. Dragdoc

    Dragdoc Well-Known Member

    Still working on it JayZee. Did fire it up but running a little rough and has a miss. Need to sort out ignition.

    For optimal carb performance almost anything will need adjustments!
     
    Reidk likes this.
  18. Fox's Den

    Fox's Den 355Xrs

    If you did not buy a carb yet Jegs is giving away a free air cleaner with a purchase of a AVS2 Edel carb just saw the E-Mail

    14" pro Flow air cleaner
     
  19. that's actually an Edelbrock promotion so if you buy a new carb from any of the vendors you get an air cleaner
     
  20. Reidk

    Reidk Well-Known Member

    I'm curious... I have this carb. My build isn't done yet. Were you happy with it?
     
    gs65 likes this.

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