Short version: I am attempting to assemble the world's first (to my knowledge) 200-4r with a proper nailhead bellhousing (no other adapter or crank spacer needed) and I am looking for someone in the Kansas City/Omaha/Des Moines area or therabouts who has a late (65 style) nailhead that's not currently in a car, so I can bolt it up and check fitment/converter clearance/etc. BEFORE I build the trans and before we take apart an original 65 GS to do the swap. All I'm asking is to show up and bolt a bare case with pump and converter to your engine, measure a couple things, and maybe leave some adult beverages for your trouble. I have a bare 200-4r case that is having the bellhousing machined off and fitted with an adapter to allow use of any existing 4L60E bolt-on bellhousing. This adapter already exists in small quantities and was developed for overseas use of the 200-4r in a Holden application. This should allow direct use of the existing nailheadbuick.com nailhead-to-4L60E bellhousing and is only marginally more expensive than the existing adapter, which hits the firewall/floorpan, requires a crank spacer and throws off driveshaft length. If this works, it allows a true drop in overdrive and will likely retain the original driveshaft length. The guy doing the case mods builds and ships performance 200-4rs for a living and could probably be coerced into making another run of adapters and could offer anything from a cut-it-yourself adapter plate to a fully built performance trans with case mods already done, with or without a trans core. ..but first we need to mock up the first one... post here, PM me or email kochpdr at hotmail if you have an engine that could work for this. thanks Bob Koch
He didn't specify. He simply stated he made a run of them to mate a 200-4r to that goofy 4/6 cylinder 4L60E bellhousing like you see in a chevy trailblazer. A couple of them went to Australia and I forget where else he said he sold a couple. I assumed that bellhousing in Australia would be a Holden, but I guess I could be wrong. It was designed to use the newer 4L60E converter which is .600 longer than the early 4l60e/700/200 style converter, but that extra .600 "should" be in the OE bellhousing and the nailhead-to-4L60E bellhousing "should" allow the early converter to mate perfect with the nailhead. I want to mockup to eliminate any doubt. Worst case scenario we have to build a hybrid converter with late dimensions and early 27 spline.
Would the QuickTime manual bellhousing work? made for the Nailhead, 4.957 inch deep. https://www.holley.com/products/drivetrain/bellhousings/bellhousings/parts/RM-6017
Bob, my name is Bill Sangster, I live near Omaha, and have a complete 66 401 on a stand in a heated area that you could use to check the fit. Thanks Bill.
I don't believe so. I mean, a guy could probably make some sort of intermediate adapter and pull it off but it won't work with what I have planned. Plus it's actually a bit more expensive than the 4L60E housing.
That will work perfect Bill! And I can probably find my way back to your house, you sold me an 84 regal with GN powertrain about 5 years ago. Can I invite the car's owner from Des Moines as well? He's actually the guy who ended up with that NOS quarter panel...
Bob, sure, no problem bring the cars owner. I always wondered what happened to the parts car. I will PM you my cell number and we can go from there. Thanks.
Ok, I was thinking the 200-4r (w/o bell) might bolt directly to the Quicktime bell with no adapters whatsoever. I have no idea if the depth is anywhere close to what is needed. Your plan is to use the Nailhead 4L60E bell with an adapter for the 200-4r, correct?
That's the plan. Even if, by some miracle, the QuickTime bell housing happens to be the correct distance for the pump bolt flange, a precision adapter still has to be machined/dowel pinned for proper crank/converter/pump alignment. I have no doubt that one could be engineered, but with such limited market for the nailhead, I doubt anyone steps up to the challenge. Frankly, even if our idea works, it'll probably take a lot of coercing for the designer to do another run of these adapters unless he can do one or two at a time. It's good news for the early gs crowd but it's still not a budget friendly option that dozens of people are going to be waiting in line for.
I'll bet that more than a few Riviera owners (myself included) would be interested if it fit as you're hoping. Steve
I have seen a 65 Riv local to me who I bought some parts from that put a 200r4 in it and I think he said he used a Dynaflow bellhousing and machined the crap out of both tranny and bell to make it work. PM me, will put you in touch with him.
Gonna leave these teaser pics right here...and when the full mockup is done I'm going to start a new thread with the info in the first post.
Found this a tad late I guess. I asked Quick Time if they could build me a bell housing to fit a Ford bolt pattern T5 to a late 401. The answer was yes for $1,000 +/- a tad. I know that Quick time has built some bell housings to adapt pruned automatic transmissions to various motors. Russ Martin has a bell housing for late 4L and 6L transmissions.
This is the Russ Martin 4L60E bellhousing bolted to an Extreme Automatics 200-4r to 4L60E adapter. Mockup went very well in Omaha, fits a 401 like a glove. Trans is still in pieces on my bench. Project temporarily stalled due to unforeseen circumstances, but if you want one of these you need to call Lonnie at Extreme Automatics. He can build you a trans with this adapter installed and then you just add the Russ Martin bellhousing. EDIT: be sure to ask for the 4L60e adapter plate from extreme automatics. He also offers an adapter to use Reid bellhousings and that adapter is much more commonly used than the 4L60e adapter. There are several wild cards to the install we haven't had the chance to sort out because it's not built yet, but the driveshaft "should" work with no mods, it "should" fit the tunnel with no tunnel mods, it "should" be able to use the same crossmember as a round top 400, etc. dipstick tube will be kind of wonky if you don't buy a Lokar or other flexible tube, trans lines probably need bent around a little, gs floor shift probably ought to use the shiftworks kit to be right. What else? Oh you have to figure out the lockup control and your carb geometry needs to be correct for a 200-4r/700r4 TV cable. I'm dying to ride in this car with this trans and a 3.42 or 3.73 rear gear and no other mods. I know there's a lot of purists in the gs crowd and that's fine. That's actually the beauty of this thing, it's completely reversible!!!
