Just pressed in new front pump bushing with red Loctite and using a pump made a series of dimples inside the bore prior to installing to the bushing to act a sort of like a stake. Video show interaction with converter hub. Too tight? Too lose? I don't know what the "textbook" clearance is suppose to be http://youtu.be/gWaAOMM_7tY
So quick update!! I am VERY Happy. After spending a lot of time with the small details of the conversion from the th400, I think we have success. I swapped the th400 style gas pedal back to my original th350 gas pedal assembly. I routed the TV cable directly to the kick-down tab on the gas pedal. The adjusting part of the TV cable snaps in at the original kickdown cable hole in the firewall. My buddy Carl came by yesterday, and we adjusted the cable. off throttle, no gas pedal, the throttle valve is not being depressed. At full WOT the TV valve is fully depressed into the valve body. as soon as I touch the throttle, the TV valve begins moving as well. I suppose I can't speak to the geometry of the sweep, but I assume it should work?? Anyhow, today, filled it up with fluid and started her up! First time since November. Started immediately! Warmed it up for about 15 minutes, topped off the fluid. No funny noises at all. It has an immediate and positive shift when I switch it in gear. With my foot on the brake, I can tell the car wants to leap forward. The new 3.73's are ready for action. Roads still to dirty, windy and dusty to take out. So! 99.9% there. I will need to ofcourse see how it shifts, where my WOT is at and ensure that the 4th gear lock-up is working as it should. No leaks. I am also able to shift the column shift all the way down into the "new" Low 1 without having to modify the neutral safety switch or anything else. Just had to adjust the shift linkage rod a bit. Thinking it might be beneficial to do a pressure test before driving? I know the pressure readings from when I had the trans dyno'd, but might be smart to test real world pressure? Nice Aluminum pan courtesy of Eric and Allen hear on the board. The CKPerformance book (thanks Ken) and the whole host of CK parts was perfect. But the test drive will tell.
Keep the info coming. I'm about 3 weeks from starting my swap from TH400 to TH2004R. I've got a complete trans coming from Extreme Automatics and I BELIEVE I have everything necessary for the swap already purchased and waiting. Looking over your pictures I think you may want to look at doing something better for your cooler lines. At the very least double up the hose clamps and get some sort of head shielding around the lines where they are in the vicinity of the header collectors. regards
I would put a gauge on it just to be sure the cable was pushing/pulling the tv open and the pressure is sufficient with it all hooked up.
I still have one on the stand but have to get the 455 together and in there first. I'm thinking on some power upgrades on the build cause it will see some strip time for sure! This is the pan I'm going to use. Deep all the way back!
Will do for sure. I did visually see the valve's operation while my sun worked the gas pedal, as I dropped the pan before adding fluid. So I can tell 100 percent the tv valve operates correspondent to the tv cable pull/length. But I would still like to see the actual pressure as it pulls. I am so excited. Can't wait for warmer weather. Need some good hard rain to clean the salt and sand to test drive. I do believe I will definitely run into some governor issues. I really want the car to shift WOT as it did with the TH400, that is at 5100 rpm or so. This is a BQ trans with better valve body and the GN governor. I know that car weight and torque and rear axle can affect the new shift points, but I am afraid it may shift higher than my liking, 54 or 5500 rpm. We'll c
Finally got a chance to run the car a bit today. I installed a pressure guage on a 7 ft hose. I am very happy that there are zero leaks. If you scroll to prior posts, you will see the build with all the CK Performance goodies. I let the car warm up. The Manual D1 and D2 pressures have me a little weary. Minimum TV at 1000 rpm has Park and Neutral at 90 psi. Reverse is 150 psi. 4, 3, 2, and 1 are all at 90 psi. Full TV at 1000 rpm has Park and Neutral at 250 psi. Reverse is 215. D4, D3 and D2 are 250 psi and D1 is 210. I think the pressure for D1 and D2 are low. I decided to go for a short cruise. Remember, I have my TV cable hooked up and adjusted to the TH350 kickdown tab on the gas pedal. It shifted great! I am VERY VERY happy with ALL the shift points, as well at WOT. It shifts strong and positive! The tires barked numerous times. Thanks Ken for the newly re-geared 3.73. In OD, the Lock up functioned as it should in 4th gear. Nice solid shifts. My only concern was when shifting it down into manual low (1) it felt as though it ever so slowly went into Low 1, as opposed to my TH400, it would snap down into low 1 when manually put in. I think that has got to do something with the lower L1 pressures?? When in drive, and I slow down to stop, it positively ****s back into 1. I don't know, gonna call Chris at CK Monday and get his thoughts. I don't understand the trans enough yet to correlate the lower pressure to applying manual 1 when downshifting into it. I was also surprised that it did not go into Manual 1 until got down to a lower speed, I assume the valve body is designed for that function. Any thoughts would be appreciated. As soon as I crack the throttle, the trans pressure begins to rise. Not sure if it rises as fast as it would if hooked to the carb? Happy Easter to all.
Did you put in a larger rev boost valve when you put the larger boost valve in the pump? If not, you know why the pressure is low. The rev boost valve also boosts pressure in low.
Good morning Rich, was hoping you would chime in as well as other. I need to look back into my notes and make sure I put that valve in as well. I could not be happier with the shift points Would the lower L1 and L2 pressure cause the frictions to slip?
Just got off the phone with Chris over at CK Performance. So I read him all the readings and the characteristics of the trans, and he told me over and over not to worry. He said those numbers were fine, especially factoring in a pressure gauge that may be a few psi off. He said those pressure were good. So, I suppose I will continue to put some miles on the trans and see what happens.
http://extremeautomatics.com/assets/pdf/2004R_Transmission_Install.pdf Not sure if this has been posted before or not but Lonnie over at Extreme Automatics lists target pressures in his install documentation.
Update.......So my wife says I am gonna jinx my 2004r if I openly say it........but I am just in love with the swap! This 2004r shifts amazing. Shifts HARD, and positive. I love the gearing with the 3.73. I ABSOLUTELY LOVE the OD!!! Man, when it locks up in 4th, it hums along on the highway and sounds and feels great. Add some throttle, TQ unlocks and downshifts! Part throttle shifts points are spot on, and WOT after some play with the weights, shift 5000 rpm on the dot! Everything works as it should, thanks to vast array of CK performance parts. I am so glad I did the swap from the th400. Only time will tell if it holds up in the long haul to the 455. WOT 1-2, impossible to keep my 295-50's from spinning through 2nd gear!!! I recommend it to anyone considering the swap. I have installed a electric trans pressure gauge in the car so I can monitor tv line pressure at all times, as I am running the tv cable to the old th350 kickdown gas pedal assembly (thanks Matt!) Hope it will be a fun summer void of any jack stands!
You, like many of us, over analyze and worry about things most people take for granted. Enjoy it! You now have the best of both worlds, awesome Buick torque and liveable cruise RPM.
I got my TH2004R from Extreme Automatics installed a couple weeks back as well and could hardly be happier. Hitting the highway and cruising at 70MPH doing a mere 2000RPM (3.42 gear 28in tires) is WONDERFUL! Curious how you handled some of the little things though. My car being a 70 has the NSS mounted on the console shifter. Without touching anything it starts in park and the reverse lights come on but no neutral starts (will crank and start in OD). I decided to just leave the switch alone even though I bought the other NSS to hack up. What did you do? I went with Mobil 1 ATF, what did you go with? Based on info from Lonnie at Extreme Automatics he's seeing some weird variations in shift quality with DEX-6 fluids and actually recommended going with B+M Trick Shift. I could not bring myself to use a non synthetic in an OD transmission and he was OK with the Mobil 1. Setting up the TV cable/valve I was surprised to find that the standard conversion plate for use with the Holley type throttle bracket did not allow enough travel to get the valve at the right min and max depth. The hole for the TH350 kick down was only about .050 in shy of being dead nuts so with a little loving with a file I was right in spec and had great pressures across the ranges. I'm not so worried about the pressures but I'm curious about temps with the combination of OD and small converter so I'm looking to install an Auto Meter trans temp gauge in the next week or so. I was running Jim Weise's old -4 cooler lines through the frame to the radiator. I upgraded to -6 braided Teflon and again ran the lines through the frame. Did you do anything with your cooling lines? regards
Congrats on the swap Sir! As far as the NSS, I was worried about it too on my 71, but I did not need to do anything to it. I literally left it alone, so even when I pull the column shift onto "new" L1, the NSS did not impede it, nor are my starts affected. What I did have to do was adjust the rod down below that the linkage hooks up to, to allow the shift to actually travel further. As far as fluid, I am just running standard CARQUEST, I want to say, DEX 3. I have not seen any issues or felt any issue what so ever with this fluid. Besides, I have had to drain it a few times for governor mod, that it is cheap enough to dump for more fresh clean fluid. I rebuilt my trans soup to nuts in the my basement, so I figured no need for synthetic, but I am no expert. I too needed to "lovingly" file the hole in the firewall to accommodate the TV cable housing to snap in. But it worked. Travel of the cable works perfectly as it should. As far as temps go, that is a guess for me. I scored a super nice finned aluminum pan here on the board from a member. They are suppose to dissipate heat. I am also running Jim's thru the frame lines. I did not upgrade them. I run them right into the my aluminum radiator, no external cooler. My coolant rarely sees temps higher then 170 degrees, so I assume the trans fluid is just fine. But I am not positive. Good luck
I have been using Dex-6 in mine with no problems. For additional cooling added a trans cooler from a Ford Ranger. All of $10 from the local yard and with a few mods to it was a clean install. Also worked well with the intercooler. Use -6 push loc lines running in the stock position. The lines are wrapped with heat reflective tape (I use a lot of that under the hood.)
I don't know if this is worth while but, when my 2004r was installed the guy (Jimmy's Transmission) bought the conversion kit for my floor shift setup. It had a complete kit including the new cable, brackets, and shifter "notch" piece. Now while the shifter doesn't exactly line up with the letters on my console (I have the chrome plated designator setup) the NSS, indicator needle on my speedo, reverse lights and everything else work perfectly. http://www.shiftworks.com/buick.htm#1968 Mark
I am restoring my 70 Le Sabre 455 coupe. Am looking at changing to a 200R4 opposed to an overdrive. I assume the 200R4 has advantages with the gearing plus giving better mileage on the highway where the OD would just help with highway mileage. Anyone have mileage figures for their conversion? I think I would get an Extreme trans 200R4 and not try to find and build one. What changes would I face on a Le Sabre? It would be column shift. Yeah, I know, boring. I have been reading the threads on this topic and have learned a lot. Just wondering the best way to proceed with a full size car. Assume would have to change the drive shaft. thanks
First, what rear gear do you have? If you don't have mid 3s, (3.42, 3.55, 3.73) an overdrive may be difficult to keep in the sweet spot. Second, what trans is in your car now, long shaft or short shaft? A short shaft turbo 400 will be pretty close with a yoke change. A long shaft will require a new, longer driveshaft. Third, make sure the builder will stand behind that trans in a heavy car with lots of torque. Depending on converter, you may have to redrill the holes as most 200-4R converters are smaller. The lockup will reduce RPM. I think I got about 2 MPG better (11 to 13) but I don't really do a lot of highway driving lately. I tend to stay on country roads that let me run about 60 while driving spirited. Overdrive for me is about 32MPH per 1000 RPM The 200-4R will give you better take off with a lower first gear to get your heavy car going. Overdrive will reduce RPM by 1/3 even if it doesn't improve mileage substantially. I think the linkage for a column shift is an easy thing. The worst case scenario is probably going to be no L1 manually.
