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  1. #1
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    Feb 2002
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    Default Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Sigh… I've been dreaming of the Perfect Stroker…. What could it be? Let's see now…

    Block: Buick 300 bored .050 out
    Maincaps: Billet Steel V6 caps
    Pistons: Hypereutectic from the Buick Supercharged 3800 V6
    Crank: Cut down Buick 340\350 to 2.5" on the mains.
    Rods: Stock 73-80 capscrew 350 bushed to take 3800 V6 pins
    Heads: TA Performance Aluminum 350 (Hey! It's MY dream!!!)
    Intake: Welded Steel single plane with injector ports
    Ignition: Ignition Man's set up
    Cam: TA Performance modified for 300\340 cam bearing size.
    Fueling: Megasquirt
    Oiling: Range Rover front cover with gerotor oil pump driven off of the crank.

    Ahh… I just woke up…. Geeze…

    Anybody got any other ideas?

    Greg

  2. #2
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    Feb 2002
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    North Carolina
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Sigh… I've been dreaming of the Perfect Stroker…. What could it be? Let's see now…


    Anybody got any other ideas?

    Greg

    Buy a running 70 or 71 455 from a junk yard.
    Jim Lore
    BPG 1037
    "If you cannot clear up the confusion at least make the confusion clear."

  3. #3

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    build it and he will come . . . .
    Andy bridgeview,il
    65 special v6 daily driver-this needs to go faster
    82 gn clone 455 12.50's on pump, soon trishield 464
    84 gn
    72 skylark convert#2 ,N-25 for sale

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Put that 350 crank into a late Rover block and you got me. I think it might hit the cam though.

    Are you thinking you'd get a low-deck 350 then?
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  5. #5
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    Feb 2002
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    287

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Oh yeah. Low deck and more compact 350. Think MGB why don't cha....

    Greg

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
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    Upstate NY 13901
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    5,820

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Check out this aluminum buick monster motor from britishv8.org.

    http://www.britishv8.org/Articles/MonsterMotor.htm

    They use 258 Jeep pistons. On the front timing cover/oil pump design...you can either use a Rover one with or w/o provisions for a distributor. Could also use a 3800 v6 one I believe.
    Scott B.


    72 GS 455 Stage 1, 70 Skylark, 92 Roadmaster

    Acts 4:12 - Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.

  7. #7
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    Dec 2005
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    Minnesota
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    400

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Now that I think on it. 3.85"! GEEZ. There is no way that would fit in the 8.9" deckheight of the Rover block. I guess I just woke up. I'm thinking the biggest thing you could put in one of those would be the 3.5" P76 crank.

    I suppose if you sleeved the late Rover block, took it out to 3.78" for the Ford turbo4 pistons, use the 215 rods, P76 crank, you've got a 340 lb. 315...

    $$$$ LOL!
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
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    287

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Quote Originally Posted by NixVegaGT View Post
    Now that I think on it. 3.85"! GEEZ. There is no way that would fit in the 8.9" deckheight of the Rover block. I guess I just woke up. I'm thinking the biggest thing you could put in one of those would be the 3.5" P76 crank.

    I suppose if you sleeved the late Rover block, took it out to 3.78" for the Ford turbo4 pistons, use the 215 rods, P76 crank, you've got a 340 lb. 315...

    $$$$ LOL!
    Well now hold on a sec. I haven't woke up yet. Check my math here:

    Rover V8 deck = 8.9" (or thereabouts)

    Buick 350 stroke = 3.85"
    Buick 300 rod = 5.96" ctr to ctr

    Let's see now: 3.85\2 = 1.925"

    1.925" + 5.96" = 7.885" - 8.9" = 1.015" left for the piston. The Buick Supercharged 3800 V6 piston is pretty darn close:

    http://kb-silvolite.com/spistons.php...tails&S_id=521

    But, it's time to wake up again...

    Greg

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Edmonton Alberta
    Posts
    13,522

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    A lot of work! Buy a Buick 350 and be done with it lol.
    __________________________________________________ ________________________________________
    My book called Small Block Buick Performance covering the V6, 215, 300, 340, and Buick 350 engines will be released soon.

    http://www.v8buick.com/forumdisplay....rformance-Book
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________________
    1970 Buick Skylark 350 street/strip with 6 point cage: Custom tube headers feed Twin T3/T4 Turbochargers, Holley 650, sheet metal single plane intake, heavily ported iron heads with oversized valves, mild Poston 114 camshaft (2800-6000 RPM), Diamond forged pistons on Hershe forged rods, balanced, ARP everywhere, dual 3" exhaust, Paddle shifted 4L80E 4 speed overdrive, Moser 12 bolt with 3.42 gear.

  10. #10
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    Dec 2005
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    Minnesota
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Ok ok... Hmmmm.

    The deckheight stock is 8.960" Let's say 0.010" to clean it up: 8.950"
    SO we are closer to 1.065"

    Destroke the rod journals by .020 (if you can even do that) get OS bearings.
    Now we're at 1.085"... OK so we don't clean up the block.

    3.8" bore x 3.83" stroke = 348 ci.

    WOW! fun. Now if it will not hit the cam... WHERE'S your sense of adventure Sean! LOL! Just think of all the gas I'm going to save if I'm not displacing an extra 2 ci every rev!
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  11. #11
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    Feb 2002
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    287

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Hey Sean, if you gonna dream... dream BIG! :-)

    Also keep this in mind. The 75-76 V6 rods are also 5.96 ctr to ctr (so I've been told) but have the later Buick capscrew design. Anyway, if the rods don't hit the cam in the Monster 300 motor, I don't think they will in the Rover motor either. Of course, I don't know if you can sleeve the later Rover motors out to 3.8". Gotta have some good heads too....

    Greg (Yawnnnnnn..)

  12. #12
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    Mar 2004
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    Edmonton Alberta
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    LOL, keep up the ideas. Its interesting but I just wanna make 700 hp with a SBB, nothing fancy just a twin turbo girdled street Buick 350.....

    Oh wait its not a dream, its my christmas present to myself! Good job Sean LOL.
    __________________________________________________ ________________________________________
    My book called Small Block Buick Performance covering the V6, 215, 300, 340, and Buick 350 engines will be released soon.

    http://www.v8buick.com/forumdisplay....rformance-Book
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________________
    1970 Buick Skylark 350 street/strip with 6 point cage: Custom tube headers feed Twin T3/T4 Turbochargers, Holley 650, sheet metal single plane intake, heavily ported iron heads with oversized valves, mild Poston 114 camshaft (2800-6000 RPM), Diamond forged pistons on Hershe forged rods, balanced, ARP everywhere, dual 3" exhaust, Paddle shifted 4L80E 4 speed overdrive, Moser 12 bolt with 3.42 gear.

  13. #13
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    Dec 2005
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    Minnesota
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    There used to be a Rover V8 developements site that sold 96.5mm (3.8") sleeves but I couldn't find it. There are liners out there though...
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  14. #14
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    May 2003
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    I-95, Old exit #69 ;]
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Put that 350 crank into a late Rover block and you got me. I think it might hit the cam though.

    huwhuh?

    they all use the same timing cover so the cam-to-crank spacing in all of these engines is the same.

    the cam isn't going to be your problem with a 340/350 crank. at least, no more of a problem than the 350 has (ie-for Gods sake, don't through a rod).

    extreme rod/piston deflection and you'll probably have to notch the piston skirts, yeah.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Oh... Good point, Bob. Duh. OK.

    I actually think it'd be ok for the piston skirts. I'm running 5.7" with a 300 crank at 3.4". The pistons I chose had to be ground a little. It was like .030.

    This would be an extra 0.225 longer and the rod is 0.26 longer. My bet is it would just make it.

    Here's the rub for me. The rod ratio is total crap: 1.55 Unheard of in a Buick.
    That paired with a shallow piston is going to put a lot of side load on the piston skirts. Then again Chevy routinely ran, still runs, really low rod ratios: 1.53 for the 454; 1.56 for the LT5; 1.48 for the SB 400. OMG! so...

    It almost makes me want to build one.
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  16. #16
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    Minnesota
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Quote Originally Posted by NixVegaGT View Post
    Ok ok... Hmmmm.

    The deckheight stock is 8.960" Let's say 0.010" to clean it up: 8.950"
    SO we are closer to 1.065"

    Destroke the rod journals by .020 (if you can even do that) get OS bearings.
    Now we're at 1.085"... OK so we don't clean up the block.
    WRONG! Ok so you'd have to destroke the crank by .030 unless we can find an alternat connecting rod. Like one that's 5.9" but then the rod ratio goes even worse.
    Last edited by NixVegaGT; 12-18-2007 at 03:02 PM.
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  17. #17
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    Feb 2002
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    287

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Quote Originally Posted by NixVegaGT View Post
    WRONG! Ok so you'd have to destroke the crank by .030 unless we can find an alternat connecting rod. Like one that's 5.9" but then the rod ratio goes even worse.
    I've been looking at this somewhat closely. I don't know now... Take a good close look at this pic:

    http://www.v8buick.com/attachment.ph...2&d=1043803085

    It's my cut down 350 crank in a P76 block. The crankcase is similar to the Rover. That's a stock 350 rod with a dummy piston. At full swing, the piston just starts to come out of the hole. With the long rod, that's not a big deal. But, with the shorter rod, it just might. Does the later Rover have exended cylinders for the longer stroke? If not, it might not work.

    Greg
    Attached Images Attached Images

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Does the later Rover have exended cylinders for the longer stroke? If not, it might not work.

    here's where you get a great excuse to sleeve the block and gain bore size.

    it's all about turning negatives into positives, friends.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    LOL! yeah, Bob!.

    Greg, You already have a 350 crank turned down to 2.5"?
    I'm with you on the shorter rod. I don't like it at all. There would be problems with the crank hitting the pistons then too. I checked with my machine shop. They confirm they have OS bearings at .030 for the rod journals so destroking to 3.82" is fine. That puts us right to the deckheight of the ROver.

    I suppose, in practice, we could chamfer the pistons to not interfere with the head if it over hangs the deck by a few thou. SC pistons must have some extra head thickness for higher cylinder pressures, right? I'm having my sleeves pressed to a couple thou over for better gasket sealing so doing something like that could make up some of the distance.

    I've posted on a couple other message boards about this combo. There has to be someone else who's tried this. I'll keep looking for the 3.8" sleeves. I'm thinking they have to be flanged because of the likely cracking in the block. The Rover blocks crack a lot behind the cylinders anyway. Otherwise I was thinking we could press in 231 sleeves...

    I'm pretty hot for this idea. I bet this engine would rock the low end numbers. Not so good on the top end. I'm thinking we'd have to limit the revs to 5k.
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Check this out:

    http://cgi.befr.ebay.be/Rover-V8-P76...QQcmdZViewItem

    Thanks to David for post from last month! This would reinforce the bottom end and add some extra pan depth...
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  21. #21
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    Feb 2002
    Posts
    287

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Quote Originally Posted by NixVegaGT View Post
    LOL! yeah, Bob!.

    Greg, You already have a 350 crank turned down to 2.5"?
    I'm with you on the shorter rod. I don't like it at all. There would be problems with the crank hitting the pistons then too. I checked with my machine shop. They confirm they have OS bearings at .030 for the rod journals so destroking to 3.82" is fine. That puts us right to the deckheight of the ROver.

    I suppose, in practice, we could chamfer the pistons to not interfere with the head if it over hangs the deck by a few thou. SC pistons must have some extra head thickness for higher cylinder pressures, right? I'm having my sleeves pressed to a couple thou over for better gasket sealing so doing something like that could make up some of the distance.

    I've posted on a couple other message boards about this combo. There has to be someone else who's tried this. I'll keep looking for the 3.8" sleeves. I'm thinking they have to be flanged because of the likely cracking in the block. The Rover blocks crack a lot behind the cylinders anyway. Otherwise I was thinking we could press in 231 sleeves...

    I'm pretty hot for this idea. I bet this engine would rock the low end numbers. Not so good on the top end. I'm thinking we'd have to limit the revs to 5k.
    Yes, I do have a crank turned down to 2.55 on the mains. Something I've had for some time (along with a couple of P76 blocks). Just an idea....

    I like the girdle.



    Greg

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Hey is that yours? That's a cross-bolted Rover block right there.

    Let's get those 96.5mm cylinder liners in there! If it is your's, where did you get the girdle? I've written to V8developements in the UK and await their responce. We'll see.
    Nic '73 Vega GT Aluminum Wildcat 355
    http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2357894

  23. #23
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    Nov 2002
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    Maplewood, MN
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    123

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Wildcat engineering already makes a modified Rover block that can accommodate combinations up to 6.0 liters.. It ist cheap though.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Belgium
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    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Hello from here.

    It is my first post here

    It's me who realized this custom alloy girdle plate for my own P76 project. It was made is in 6014 aircraft grade aluminium. The girlde plate has an thickness of 20mm. I ordered also an custom 5.250'' John Eales (UK) Main Studs which utilise the maximum possible amount of thread lenght in the block.

  25. #25
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    Feb 2002
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    287

    Default Re: Dreaming of a Small Block Stroker....

    Good to see you've made it over here Dimitri!

    What's the price on the girdle?

    Greg

 

 
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