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  1. #1
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    Question A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Well I think this thread is way over do.

    We 300 guys need your help. What can be done to this little 300 to make it perform and still run efficiently?

    I have a car equiped with one in it and will keep it in there where it belongs.

    So I'm asking for any and all input on making this small block stand up and be reckognized!!


    Thanks and please "Sticky" this thread.
    Last edited by D-Con; 10-31-2009 at 10:17 AM.
    NY Chicago 64 65 Posse

    GSCA # 3741
    BPG # 1991
    494 Stroker, in the works
    2002 White Diamond Cadillac DeVille
    1965 GranSport 4 speed Coupe (Under Resto)
    1965 Skylark 462 12.21@109.8
    1964 Special Fireball V6, 3 on the tree! Sold
    1987 Grand National
    1987 SS Monte T-Tops 4sale..Gone. BACK!! Sold
    1995 Slammed Asstro
    17 in Boyd Coddingtons
    Daily Driver: retired :(
    1998 2 Door Blue Tahoe New
    Daily Runner, Garage kept Gem! :)

  2. #2
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by GranSportSedan View Post
    From what i understand XS is no longer selling kits.
    that sucks oh and if you want to go turbo(s)

    http://www.chevroletls1.com/rover_v8.html
    Mike aka BiZnO
    72 twinturbo Skylark

    Buick 350 Inspirational members to me..
    TuBBeD for his 551+ N/A build
    BillMah52 First to take a 350 where no man has gone before
    Justa350 First to hang a pair of turbos and cause Kaos
    GSJohnny First to max out the bore at .090 and his .075 and have engines that actually breath well N/A!
    Bobb Makley First well known to Stroke a 350
    Ken Betts, Hopefully the guy to pull-off 350 AL heads :-D

  3. #3
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Mark's single 350 turbo kit might be compatible with the 300.
    Cason P.
    71 Skylark 350-4V
    Hooker Headers
    Ken G. 1973 Q-Jet
    D5 GN Converter/200R4
    3.42 Posi Rear
    In Development:
    Either this Car kills me, or I kill the car first!

  4. #4
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by calvdog45 View Post
    Has anyone ever thought about a screw-type supercharger for the 300? I talked to Kenne Bell, but they weren't very helpful. "We don't make a kit for any Buicks and we don't sell parts". I guess a person could maybe find a used one and make an intake. Depends on what you're willing to do.

    Well there was a roots blown 215, however he is now using a 340. Either way a custom intake is needed... Some 300 info here:

    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=120272

    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=137973

    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=139115

    There was a fellow who added a roots blower onto a Buick 350 using a stock intake and some adapter plates:

    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ghlight=blower


    I would go with a single Turbo and be done with it.
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________
    My book called Small Block Buick Performance covering the V6, 215, 300, 340, and Buick 350 engines will be released soon.

    http://www.v8buick.com/forumdisplay....rformance-Book
    __________________________________________________ ____________________________
    1970 Buick Skylark Turbo 350 street/strip

  5. #5
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    This is a good thread, if we can get the people with the know how to share.
    The little engine could put out 250 horse stock with a 4 barrel and get very good milage, so you know that it's got potential!
    Problem is that it was a short lived engine and there were better muscle options out there so not a lot of after market stuff.
    Fortunately we don't need a lot of after market interest, just enough of the right aftermarket interest! There have to be tricks from back in the day for better performance. It was stock in the best looking A body built after all!
    If there are no parts, then someone has figured out how to get the most out of it with what they could come up with.
    David
    Raymond Washington

    Empty garage, for now.
    Still room in the garage for the next 65

  6. #6
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by 1967GS340 View Post
    This is a good thread, if we can get the people with the know how to share.
    The little engine could put out 250 horse stock with a 4 barrel and get very good milage, so you know that it's got potential!
    Problem is that it was a short lived engine and there were better muscle options out there so not a lot of after market stuff.
    Fortunately we don't need a lot of after market interest, just enough of the right aftermarket interest! There have to be tricks from back in the day for better performance. It was stock in the best looking A body built after all!
    If there are no parts, then someone has figured out how to get the most out of it with what they could come up with.
    This guy runs 12s NA with a 300:

    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=118598

    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=137991
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________
    My book called Small Block Buick Performance covering the V6, 215, 300, 340, and Buick 350 engines will be released soon.

    http://www.v8buick.com/forumdisplay....rformance-Book
    __________________________________________________ ____________________________
    1970 Buick Skylark Turbo 350 street/strip

  7. #7
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe65SkylarkGS View Post
    How bout it Buick experts??

    Doc Larry Walt??

    Need some help. Where is the oil pum located? Does the oiling system require upgrading?

    Little help here fellas?
    Oil pump is the same as the 350. Do you "need" to upgrade the oil system? Depends on your build I would think.
    Cason P.
    71 Skylark 350-4V
    Hooker Headers
    Ken G. 1973 Q-Jet
    D5 GN Converter/200R4
    3.42 Posi Rear
    In Development:
    Either this Car kills me, or I kill the car first!

  8. #8
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Hi all,

    I am running a 300/ 4V in my Daily Driver 65 sepcial with a Poston 110A cam and it gets close to 20 MPH and has plenty of go for a 4 door and a stick helps

    these motors are highly under rated, but are great for a crusier/ driver

    I got the car from Brian Stone, who built the engine & I got the car from, so you may want to check with him as he has lots of knowledge onthe early cars, but I believe he said he was runnig 350 pistons in his 64 car and a lot bigger cam

    There was a guy a few years ago, I ran into ad the Buick show in Flint that ran a 64 special that ran 12's in MI believe he was running 4 10 gears and a TH350, He was selling the car I believe on this site back then maroon special so I appligize if I forget the name.

    good info and some $$ things to consider

    I did see a post for shorty headers for 340's a while back and imagine they would fit a 300 as with Poston gone no telling who will pick up that product line if anyone, hope someone does though

    thanks all for the info, and keep the little 300 going
    Jim


    1964 Skylark 2 door 340, 4v auto (future 430 4 speed-M-20)
    1965 Skylark 2 door post car (401, 2-4's, 4 speed M22W [AutoGear])
    1965 Special 4 door 355 wildcat 4 speed-T-10
    1964 Special 2 door (future project 65GS 401/3 speed stick)

  9. #9
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Crower and Isky both make cams. I believe that Comp or Crane does as well. I built my '65 300 back in 1996, using a rebuild kit from PAW, crower cam, Poston dual valve springs, Poston headers, and edelbrock carb on a '64 aluminum intake. I reused the stock pistons, but if doing it again would probably use Jeep 258 pistons and custom rods.

    You CAN use the 64 intake on the later engines, you just have to block the exhaust "cross overs" in the heads, and port match the intake if that bothers you. The crower cam grind was #50232 and I was really pleased with it. I'm debating using that cam or #50234 for my next 300 build I'm planning for this winter.

    I think the biggest thing is knowing that these engines need specific (early) items like lifters and pushrods and making sure that you get the correct parts; and not the later 350 stuff that won't work as a direct bolt on.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    My 300 has a stock 2-barrel intake like most 300's. What would be a reasonable price to pay if you find a 4-barrel intake? That would be a simple upgrade for most. Iron or aluminum.
    Dave Calvert

    1965 Buick Special Deluxe Wagon

    Former
    1995 Buick Riviera
    1972 Dodge Challenger
    1968 Chrysler New Yorker
    1973 Buick Century

  11. #11
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Great thread. Thanks Joe for intiating. I bought my car with the intentions of an engine swap, but I have come to love the 300 and decided to keep it. Its a great Lil' engine. Mines pretty much stock for now other than an Edelbrock 500 CFM carb. Im anxious to see someone try the new T/A heads on one.

    T & D has roller rockers.
    3.8 turbo motor has a larger oil pick up that I understand works. Isky and Crower both offer solid and hydra. cams. MSD has distributers.

    Who made the full length headers for Poston?
    How hard would it be to get a roller cam. Would 3.8 roller lifters work?
    Stroke it using a 340 or 350 Crank?
    Could you use the 3.8 turbo exhaust by adding one extra pipe to each side? I would think we could borrow alot from the expertise of the 3.8 turbo guys.
    Last edited by 64G-lark; 10-29-2009 at 09:16 PM. Reason: more info.
    Mark
    1964 Skylark 300/355 Wildcat, 4 speed, 3.55 posi

  12. #12
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by GranSportSedan View Post
    I wonder if the main cap bolts are the same width on the 300 vs the 340. if they are maybe we could use the 340 main caps on a 340 block and open the main saddles in the block up to the 340 or 350 main size.
    The 300 main journal diameter is 2.4995" while the 340 (and 350) main journal diameter is 3". I don't know if the bolt centers are the same or not. I suspect that they aren't though. But since the 340 and 350 share the same stroke I don't see what this would gain you. I considered turning the mains down on a 340 crank to stroke the 300 but am not sure if that would help that much. I don't have any actual test data, but the desktop dyno shows no real benefit to that long a stroke on my combination 300. It did show that a custom stroke of 3.65 (1/4" over stock) would be very impressive. But I don't think I have the $$$ for that.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by 64G-lark View Post
    Great thread. Thanks Joe for intiating. I bought my car with the intentions of an engine swap, but I have come to love the 300 and decided to keep it. Its a great Lil' engine. Mines pretty much stock for now other than an Edelbrock 500 CFM carb. Im anxious to see someone try the new T/A heads on one.

    T & D has roller rockers.
    3.8 turbo motor has a larger oil pick up that I understand works. Isky and Crower both offer solid and hydra. cams. MSD has distributers.

    Who made the full length headers for Poston?
    How hard would it be to get a roller cam. Would 3.8 roller lifters work?
    Stroke it using a 340 or 350 Crank?
    Could you use the 3.8 turbo exhaust by adding one extra pipe to each side? I would think we could borrow alot from the expertise of the 3.8 turbo guys.

    Great questions Mark.

    I allready have the bbb in a 65 and want on. I can daily drive.
    Well kinda.

    Looking forward to getting some good info here.

    Still waiting for some expertese fellas.

    Cleareances, distributor upgrades? Plug type?

    Dress up pieces?

    (please sticky this thread).

    Well when we get some good technical info maybe?
    NY Chicago 64 65 Posse

    GSCA # 3741
    BPG # 1991
    494 Stroker, in the works
    2002 White Diamond Cadillac DeVille
    1965 GranSport 4 speed Coupe (Under Resto)
    1965 Skylark 462 12.21@109.8
    1964 Special Fireball V6, 3 on the tree! Sold
    1987 Grand National
    1987 SS Monte T-Tops 4sale..Gone. BACK!! Sold
    1995 Slammed Asstro
    17 in Boyd Coddingtons
    Daily Driver: retired :(
    1998 2 Door Blue Tahoe New
    Daily Runner, Garage kept Gem! :)

  14. #14
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    I like the idea of Marks single turbo. He can design a setup for you so that you retain your A/C etc. It would be different from all the other upgrades, but if you know someone who has a Grand National or a Turbo T - con them into a ride.
    until you open the hood and count 6 plug wires yourself- you will doubt- after, you will be a convert. Effortless seemingly endless power, sounds that will make your nads tighten up, sounds that will confuse and scare the ricers as you blow by them . Turbo Power is amazing. Turbo power on a V8 is ( can be ) insane. And your car will start, idle and drive normally until you mash it, then there's no need to hang on cause the only place you are going is straight back into the seat. Talk to Mark- your motor need not be super high buck, you can use the stock heads, other posters already found solutions for affordable internals, run a mild 8~10 pounds of boost and you'll be a boost junkie for life!!
    Robert
    Last edited by roboteq-1@hotma; 10-30-2009 at 03:28 AM. Reason: words

  15. #15
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe65SkylarkGS View Post
    Dress up pieces?
    Offenhauser finned valve covers for a 215 are avail. About $200.
    Late model Rover V8 valve covers should work too.

    Quote Originally Posted by roboteq-1@hotma View Post
    I like the idea of Marks single turbo.
    Robert
    Yeah, that thread has me thinking too! I love turbos. The power surge is very addictive. Now I'm thinking of building a turbo'd 340 to put in my old 79 Turbo Regal.

    Anyone know what Rover V8 parts will swap onto a 300/340?
    Walt K
    (1)'66 GS Astro Blue, 13.41 et (2)'66 GS Saddle Mist, L76 Q-jet option, 1 of 132 (3)'66 GS Flame Red, Calif car (4)'66 GS Silver Mist, 4 speed (5)'66 Special, Flame Red, 300 (6)'79 Turbo Regal, 14.1 et (7)'65 GS 4 speed 'vert

  16. #16
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Matt View Post
    You CAN use the 64 intake on the later engines, you just have to block the exhaust "cross overs" in the heads, and port match the intake if that bothers you.
    Matt, everyone else on this board will tell you it can't be done.
    Well, I've done the swap too.... So that makes two of us that have proven it CAN be done.
    Walt K
    (1)'66 GS Astro Blue, 13.41 et (2)'66 GS Saddle Mist, L76 Q-jet option, 1 of 132 (3)'66 GS Flame Red, Calif car (4)'66 GS Silver Mist, 4 speed (5)'66 Special, Flame Red, 300 (6)'79 Turbo Regal, 14.1 et (7)'65 GS 4 speed 'vert

  17. #17
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Any one tried the rebuild kits from eVilbay? I've seen them on there from basic to master rebuild kits and the price of course is dependant upon whick kit you buy. Falcon Sales and Maddog Racing both have kits across the spectrum. Also just saw a 300 4 barrel intake for 295 !!
    Last edited by 1965Buick; 10-30-2009 at 09:15 PM. Reason: spelling

  18. #18
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by wkillgs View Post
    Matt, everyone else on this board will tell you it can't be done.
    Well, I've done the swap too.... So that makes two of us that have proven it CAN be done.
    I'm glad that there's someone else out there who agrees with me. I guess the problem is that I did it before there was "the internet" to say that it couldn't be done.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by ubushaus View Post
    Sorry dude. I'm an accountant - not an engineer type. My box has little in it, and even less outside it!
    now that is funny!

    My brother just ordered a solid lifter cam for a 300 from TA, so yes, they do have them. Someone should condense this down to a single post when there is a good chunk of info and I will sticky it in the SB forum.
    Adam

    No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but billions of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Heres a article on a stroked 300. Full Article with pictures is here

    http://www.britishv8.org/Articles/MonsterMotor.htm

    Buick Monster Motor
    (originally published in British V8 Newsletter, Volume X Issue 3, September 2002)

    by: Kurt Schley

    Over the years, a few MG V-8'ers have installed the aluminum head 1964 Buick 300 engine into their cars and have been pleased with the results. The '64 300 is not a whole lot heavier than the 215, while providing 85 more cubic inches and gobs of torque. (The 1965 and later 300's have much heavier cast iron heads) For those who speculate about such things, there was always the question: "Would a Buick 350crank, with its very long stroke, 3.85" vs. the 300's 3.4", fit into the confines of a 300 block, yielding a large displacement but still relatively light weight engine?"

    Dave Michel, who has been very heavily involved in MGV8's for many years finally decided to find out. He and 215/300 expert Dan La Grou, proprietor of D&D Fabrications in Almont, MI, discussed the feasibility and obstacles over a period of several months. Then Dave gave the go-ahead to build the engine and Dan promptly began preliminary mock-ups of the combination.
    It was discovered early on that the chief problem was going to be providing sufficient internal clearance for the relatively large Buick 350 crankshaft to be able to swing freely inside the confines of the 300 block. Testing of mock-ups revealed that there were three principle areas of interference:

    1) The connecting rod bolts on four cylinders would not clear the camshaft. Careful measurements and precision grinding of the contacting bolt heads finally allowed the connecting rods to swing past the cam. Slight additional grinding then provided a sufficient safety factor to make sure the bolts and cam did not meet, as internal dimensions changed when the engine heated up and from centrifugal forces when under power.

    2) The ends of the connecting rod bolts on the front two crankshaft journals were hitting the inside of the oil pan. This is the area in the front of the engine where the oil pan is shallow. Note: The shallow area of the pan actually extends further back than the illustration. Reducing the length of the bolts by grinding provided the necessary clearance. The bolts were not ground as far back as the nuts, so there was no reduction in strength.

    3) The largest obstacle by far was that the leading edge of the crankshaft counterweights would not clear the bottom edge of the slipper-type pistons. Careful measurements revealed that an area 0.025" high X 1" X 1" long wide had to be removed from each piston skirt and pin boss per Figs. A & B. After laying out the areas to be removed using machinist's dye, the skirts were ground. The counterweights actually interfered with only one side of each piston's skirt. However to keep each piston in balance, aluminum had to be removed from both sides of each piston.

    A late Rover "intermediate" front cover was used. This cover incorporates a compact and highly efficient crankshaft driven oil pump, as well as an improved water pump design, while still retaining provision for a conventional distributor. It was used chiefly on the Rover 4.2 and late 3.9 Rover engines.

    The 4.0 and 4.6 Rover engines used flywheel triggered electronic ignition and their front covers will not accept a distributor. All later Rover engines, 4.0, 4.2 and 4.6, drive the water pump, alternator and all other accessories with a flat serpentine belt arrangement which rotates the water pump in the opposite direction from the earlier Rover and the 215/300 pumps. The Monster Motor was fitted with custom brackets and billet aluminum pulleys designed by Dan LaGrou.

    The motor will soon be installed by Dave into an MGB. A report on the engine's performance will be forthcoming.

    Engine Specifications: Displacement: 348 ci
    Bore: 3.790"
    Stroke: 3.85"
    Block: Buick 300
    Crankshaft: Buick 350
    Heads: '64 Buick 300, ported
    Intake Valve: 1.720" dia.
    (Stock Buick 300 = 1.625")
    Exhaust Valve: 1.496" dia.
    (Stock Buick 300 = 1.313")
    Valve Springs: Crane 99849
    Head Gasket: 0.040" thick
    Lifter: 896
    Rocker Arm 1.6:1 Buick 215/300
    Camshaft: Crower 50232
    Piston: 258 Jeep
    Rings: 5/64", 5/64", 3/16"
    (Hastings Moly)
    Connecting Rod: Buick 300
    Deck Height: 0.040"
    Chamber volume: 46cc
    Compression Height: 1.630"
    Compression Ratio: 10.2:1
    Carb: Edelbrock 1404
    Primary Jet: 0.086"
    Secondary Jet: 0.095"
    Rod: 65-52

    Intake manifold: '64 Buick 300
    Ignition: OEM Delco w/ Pertronix kit
    Flywheel: Buick 300
    Pressure Plate: 10.4" Weber
    Clutch Disc: 10.4" Weber
    (1-1/8 x 26-spline)
    Front Cover/Water Pump:
    Late Rover w/ serpentine belt
    A/C Compressor: Sanden 508
    Starter: D&D gear reduction
    Alternator: Chrome one-wire
    Mark
    1964 Skylark 300/355 Wildcat, 4 speed, 3.55 posi

  21. #21
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by GranSportSedan View Post

    turbo V6 and 350 pistons will fit a 300

    This is FALSE; The v6 and 350 have a bore size of 3.8" whereas the 300 and 340's have a bore size of 3.750"... So unless you are going to bore your 300 or 340 out .050", it's not going to happen...

    Just had to clear this up before someone made the mistake of buying a set of .030 over V6 pistons

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  22. #22
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    yes, but you have to make sure that people understand that they will have to over-bore a signifigant ammount to make them work

    the original post made it sound like one could just "throw them in"

    sorry if i sounded testy, that was not my intention

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  23. #23
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    .050" to make stock v6/350 pistons work, more if you're working with "oversize" pistons

    *300/340- 3.750" bore
    *v6/350- 3.800" bore

    just FYI

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  24. #24
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    I know of several members who bored the 300 .050" over and are running forged 350 std bore pistons.

    Dont forget Sean Etson (BuickCityPsycho) he built a 64' Special with a NA 300 that went 12.52@104. Below is 2002 post from Team Buick (Buicks net) by Sean Etson about his 300 combination that runs 12s:

    Car--1964 Buick Special 2dr post
    Fiberglass hood,deck lid and rear bumper, front comeing this winter.inner fenders removed core support swisscheesed.

    Rear end is from a 72 skylark 8 1/2" housing with a strange spool and 4.11 gears and G body alum. drums.
    Suspension-rear-Metco lowers stock uppers (custom made adjustable this winter)C/E no hop bars-front-stock with C/E adj. shocks,alum GS drum fr brakes S10 master cyl. wilwood adj. proportioning valve.

    Trans.-TH350 custom built by a friend, a rebuilt B&M converter(not enough stall)an 8" 4000 stall to come ,hopefully. Headers are from Poston's 1 5/8"primaries 3" collectors

    Now for the topsecret part. 64 300 block .030" over bore,line honed zero decked, oiling system mods,front cover new GM ported oil passages blue printed oil pump Dynagear double row timing chain.custom ground cam by ISKY .535"int. .525"exh 110` lobe center 304`@.050 dur. stock crank blueprinted stock rods w/ARP bolts.high comp. pistons w/costom owner done valve reliefs with owner made tools.

    Heads-64 aluminum 300 head castings stock size valves pro done race valve job extensive porting(owner done)

    Intake-started life as a Huffacker for a 215" single plane w/ a 2" spacer my adapter plates are 1/2" thick alum. 1/4" valley plate. a 650 Holley HP series carb tops it off.

    Ignition is a Mallory unilite triggering an Accel 300+.
    Last edited by 64G-lark; 11-01-2009 at 08:24 PM. Reason: correction
    Mark
    1964 Skylark 300/355 Wildcat, 4 speed, 3.55 posi

  25. #25
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    I think that it would be helpful if anybody has engine blueprinting info and physical dimensions for the 300 to post it. The only thing that seems easy to find is stock bore/stroke/rod length. At various places online I've seen 3 different compression heights, 2 different deck heights, etc, etc. Or if anybody has a secret link to this info that would help too.

    That way the numerous "Just use [insert whatever engine here] pistons/rods/whatever" can be evaluated in context.

 

 
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