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  1. #101
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    Jul 2010
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Thanks Guys.

    I did not intend on dissing the "radical mods" but this thread did not really appear as guide to building the mighty 300 as I saw it. When I proceed with my build I will write up a guide to as what I do.

    Thanks again for the input I will get the books mentioned.

    I was looking for something to the tune of.

    I had the machine shop do this and that.

    I bought these internals with part numbers.

    I bought these externals with part numbers.

    There just did not seem to be a consensus on parts and or machine work as there is on lets say a chebby website. Like we all run this combination to achieve x. Or stay away from doing this and that.

    I will write up a guide and post it here when I complete this project.

    Thanks again


    Kelly

  2. #102
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Kelly ,,, go to the wrenchin secrets section and read my list of cheap tricks there....just some ideas....
    Doc "Widely unknown"

  3. #103
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Ok cool

  4. #104
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    1,352

    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Also, things like oiling mods have been discussed ad nausium in these threads, apply to all Buick engines, and can be found with a simple search.

    JB

  5. #105
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    Jan 2007
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    1,352

    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    That's not to say you shouldn't ask. It's just that you should not insist on a speedy answer if it's something you could have just as easily looked up.

    And along that line... I know the 215 heads have some exhaust manifold bolts that are drilled into the water jacket and you have to put sealant on the threads or you'll have anti-freeze dripping off the exhaust pipes. The '64 300 heads have a lot in common with the 215 heads. But do they also have that problem? Anybody know right off hand for sure?

    JB

  6. #106
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Hi Kelly, I'm not into all the intricate mods myself. That's why I quit responding to this post. I saw the direction it was going so just quit. I didn't do all the stroking, piston and rod changing stuff myself. I did a lot of little things that really added up. Ran like hell. Just ask some of the 350 chebby guys I beat. It's really the air flow that counts. From the air horn to the ehxaust tips. Forget about the Aluminum parts. They're too much of a hassle to modify. Runners and valves are too small. Sure, you can open them up but not as far as you can open up the iron pieces. Get the cleanest and smoothest air flow you can. Port match everything. I could go into all the little stuff I did but it would take up too much space. Get in touch if you want more.
    Now all the aluminum parts guys can start flaming.

    PONCH


    65' Buck Skylark
    65' Buick GS

  7. #107
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    Sep 2009
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    Stroudsburg, PA
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    482

    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by ponch65 View Post
    Forget about the Aluminum parts. They're too much of a hassle to modify. Runners and valves are too small. Sure, you can open them up but not as far as you can open up the iron pieces. Now all the aluminum parts guys can start flaming.

    PONCH
    Ponch I basically agree with you. I'm only using the aluminum heads on my current build because the calculated static compression ratio is 12.5:1 and I figured that the aluminum heads would help me in the detonation area. Though I'm still expecting to run race fuel. However, you're correct in the port flow comparisons.

    For example, I had Greg Gessler port me (2) sets of 300 heads, one set cast iron and one set aluminum. The cast iron heads had his "level 3" full port and rebuild. These heads flowed 196/134 @ .600" lift. The aluminum heads had his "level 4" full port, big valves, etc, etc and they flowed 179/138 @ .600" lift. There may be some additional flow there but I'm not too sure. I told him it was a max effort engine and to get me his max and that's what I got.
    Big Matt

    '65 Special w/300 V8
    '65 Skylark w/300 V8
    '66 Skylark w/430 big block
    '69 Skylark w/350
    (2) complete 455's waiting to be built

  8. #108
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    Dec 2002
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    Bucks County, Pa
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    6,532

    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by sean Buick 76 View Post
    I guess I should clarify that there are 3 different types of 300 heads:

    1. the 64 Alum heads
    2. the 65 Iron heads
    3. the 66 Iron heads

    Looking at a casting #1374870 (65 300) compared to the casting #1376330 (66 300/340) the intake passages look different to me, I should cc the chambers.
    Sean, was there a smog (A.I.R. injection) head in 1966?

    Quote Originally Posted by 64special300 View Post
    I will write up a guide and post it here when I complete this project.

    Kelly
    Kelly, that would be great! Ponch has posted pics of his head work, a couple guys have recommended cams (watch retainer-guide clearance), and maybe I relayed the tip from Sean Etson about using ARP 283 chevy rod bolts.
    All ingredients for a basic hp rebuild.
    Oil system mods from the 350-455 would apply to the 300. I'd guess the booster plate and correct tolerances would be sufficient for a 300.


    Quote Originally Posted by Big Matt View Post
    Ponch I basically agree with you. I'm using the aluminum heads on my current build ...
    However, you're correct in the port flow comparisons.
    .
    Matt, Good to see some numbers. How do they compare at 0.450" lift?
    I'm also curious at what rpm the small port alum 4bbl intake becomes a hindrance on my iron head 300....
    Walt K
    (1)'66 GS Astro Blue, 13.41 et (2)'66 GS Saddle Mist, L76 Q-jet option, 1 of 132 (3)'66 GS Flame Red, Calif car (4)'66 GS Silver Mist, 4 speed (5)'66 Special, Flame Red, 300 (6)'79 Turbo Regal, 14.1 et (7)'65 GS 4 speed 'vert

  9. #109
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Quote Originally Posted by wkillgs View Post
    Matt, Good to see some numbers. How do they compare at 0.450" lift?

    I'm also curious at what rpm the small port alum 4bbl intake becomes a hindrance on my iron head 300....
    Walt - here's the complete flow tests for both sets of the Gessler 300 heads:

    Cast Iron Level 3 with 1.81" intake and 1.45" exhaust valves
    .100" .200" .300" .400" .500" .600"
    58/48 121/87 166/111 182/121 190/129 196/134

    Aluminum Level 4 with 1.77" intake and 1.50" exhaust valves
    .100" .200" .300" .400" .500" .600"
    58/44 117/88 162/116 173/129 176/135 179/138

    Okay, so this is the first time I've actually compared them side by side, rather than just looking at the peak flow numbers. Pretty interesting, huh? Obviously the almost 20 CFM at the peak stands out but to me they're right there and the exhaust side is actually better. It is totally an apples to oranges comparison however. Perhaps an unported comparison would be better. I believe in the archives there is an unported comparison.

    But anyway, these are the numbers that Greg got me and I think that they're pretty good. For instance Dave Nelson got (I believe) only 20 CFM more on his cast iron heads used in the Hot Rod 349 stroker motor and he got something like 390 HP. Since I'm only feeding 312 cubic inches in my aluminum head engine, the HP/cubic inch should be comparable, assuming equivalent engine specs (cam, compression, etc). Maybe I'm wrong in my thinking but I guess we'll see.

    As for the intake, who's to know? As you're aware, I along with you seem to be the only two people that believe it's even possible to run the aluminum intake on a cast iron headed 300. No matter how you slice it, I feel that the aluminum 4 bbl intake will out perform the cast iron 2 bbl intake regardless of the port sizes - at some point the carb becomes the "choke point." Hell, that was one of my first mods back in the day and it made a tremendous difference; and that's why I've tried to convince everyone that it IS possible (provided you address the exhaust cross overs) and a great idea for performance/economy.
    Big Matt

    '65 Special w/300 V8
    '65 Skylark w/300 V8
    '66 Skylark w/430 big block
    '69 Skylark w/350
    (2) complete 455's waiting to be built

  10. #110
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Matt, Those are some GREAT numbers for an Aluminum head. I've never seen any numbers for either head. I would get asked what do they flow? Atomized Gas and Air. But in a do it yourself situation such as I did without changing valves I'd stick with the Hevvy Dooty ones. In your case, 12.5 Comp!? Aluminum all the way. It'll probably help a lot pulling the heat out. Sounds like a neat combo you have. It's a lot more fun making a lion out of a cub rather than starting with a lion and pulling his tail.

    Also those cross-sectioned pics of mine; They arent ported. I would just slide the valve in upside down in the head I'm working on and get the measurements from the slice.
    PONCH


    65' Buck Skylark
    65' Buick GS

  11. #111
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Some pictures of what I'm doing with the 300 in my wagon... Grainy spy photos










    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  12. #112
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    New Jersey
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Hmm, please keep us posted.


    NY Chicago 64 65 Posse

    GSCA # 3741
    BPG # 1991
    494 Stroker, in the works
    2002 White Diamond Cadillac DeVille
    1965 GranSport 4 speed Coupe (Under Resto)
    1965 Skylark 462 12.21@109.8
    1964 Special Fireball V6, 3 on the tree! Sold
    1987 Grand National
    1987 SS Monte T-Tops 4sale..Gone. BACK!! Sold
    1995 Slammed Asstro
    17 in Boyd Coddingtons
    Daily Driver: retired :(
    1998 2 Door Blue Tahoe New
    Daily Runner, Garage kept Gem! :)

  13. #113
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    I made a form out of steel channel to press the ends of a round tube tapering into a rectangular shape. Did 8 runners, but was not happy with the size (should have used 2" OD tube instead of 2.25"), perhaps they'll work for a future Buick 350 intake.










    So, the new runners will be formed out of sheet aluminum with a taper built into them.


    I also decided that the 4.5" ID aluminum tube was not going to cut it for the plenum, so that is going to be made out of a sheet aluminum also.

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  14. #114
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    HMMMM,,,, looks like what I am doing with the nailhead intake I am working on....
    Doc "Widely unknown"

  15. #115
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    I've been following your progress as well Doc.

    I have been pondering making a nailhead EFI intake for quite some time. When I do make one (once this project is done and the engine management is verified as viable), I was/am going to make it for a set of heads with the original intake flanges completely milled off much like the "Rotted Honda" heads from a while back. Then hopefully some forced induction after that.

    May I make one suggestion though? I would not consider for a minute the intake spacers that some are suggesting. My and many others' experiences with that vendor have been full of broken promises and deadlines never reached. If you do go that route, be prepared for epic excuses and months of waiting.

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  16. #116
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    I hear you,,,, no,,,, I am making my own flanges....I have a lot of things to overcome doing this thing.....but , my idea is this,,, make a manifold that looks somewhat like the factory iron one,,, and will just bolt on and work.... the only deviation that I am thinking about is a hot water manifold under the bottom of it to heat it up ... like buick did with the 300 manifold.... instead of exhaust heat that will eat the aluminum up....
    I am leaning toward two manifolds, back to back , welded together in the center,,, and then there is the issue of all the fittings , bolt holes, ect. that have to be made and welded on ....but first I have to learn to tig weld aluminum.... but I can cut out and shape and fit and make patterns... ect...
    Doc "Widely unknown"

  17. #117
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    I will be following your progress closely

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  18. #118
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Runners and bolt spacers



    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  19. #119
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    Edmonton Alberta
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Great progress!
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________
    My book called Small Block Buick Performance covering the V6, 215, 300, 340, and Buick 350 engines will be released soon.

    http://www.v8buick.com/forumdisplay....rformance-Book
    __________________________________________________ ____________________________
    1970 Buick Skylark Turbo 350 street/strip

  20. #120
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    moving along at a snail's pace between work, waiting for materials to arrive, and the welder having time.

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  21. #121
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Dos anyone know what C/R youll get with a set of 3.8/350 pistons in a 300

    Theres been lots of talk about how to make them fit, but not how much gain or loss of compression.
    '64 Special - My angel, my all, my immortal beloved...


  22. #122
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    depends on how many cc's the dome or dish of the piston, compression height of the piston (3.8 and 350s are slightly different)

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  23. #123
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    Default Re: A

    Thats what Im asking.

    Dos anyone know the cc of the heads, and the ccs of the commonly availible pistons?

    What CR are 10-1 350, 8.5-1 350 and 8.0-1 V6 pistons in a 300?

    Say on a 10-1 350 piston in a 300 do the fewer CIs cancel out the smaller comp-chamber and bring you back to 10-1?



    Im just saying that this would be some VERY VERY usefull info in a thread called A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300
    '64 Special - My angel, my all, my immortal beloved...


  24. #124
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    some intake progress...























    Like a boss...

    '64 Riv

    '65 Special WAGON... turbo and EFI here I come
    http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.ph...ntake-and-more

  25. #125
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    Default Re: A guide to building the lil guy. The Mighty 300

    Thats gonna be wild looking.... I am jealous,,, I wanna be able to tig weld that purty so bad..... Just bought my machine,,, gotta learn how to use it before I can finish my nailhead intake....lookin good... real good....
    Doc "Widely unknown"

 

 
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