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  1. #126
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure On Pre Lube!

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianBird View Post
    If I back it off (counter clockwise right? ) It will not start.
    No, turning the distributor counterclockwise is advancing ignition timing, making a hard-starting problem worse.

    Devon
    Fuel & Brake Systems Engineer
    "I can live with doubt and uncertainty and not knowing. I think it's much more interesting to live not knowing than to have answers which might be wrong." - Feynman
    "Good data is precious. The problem I have is when some damned fool fails to use it properly." - Slingerland

  2. #127
    Join Date
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Thanks Devon.
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  3. #128
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
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    Bathurst NB
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    930

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Ok...I checked TC bolts, all snug. I took VC off, no loose or bent pushrods, springs, rocker arms etc all look good. I disconnected my coil to ensure no start and turned over my engine to observe rocker movement, all visually were operating ok.

    I backed off the timing and wanted to restart. NO SPARK. I assume that turning the engine over with the coil plug wire disconnected is either bad for my coil or bad for my petronix! Anyone get this before?

    I am hoping that retarding the timing may make that noise go away. As I believe my initial timing was dialled in way too high. (Hard start, engine died as soon as I let off the gas idle and running hot)
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  4. #129
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
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    elk city, ok
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    it shouldnt hurt anything cranking the engine with the coil unplugged. i would make sure you have everything plugged in. get a test light.
    check for power on the positive side of the coil.
    if cranking it with the coil wire off would burn the pertronix or your coil up i would never use that kind again.

    check the simple things first cap rotor and wires. did you test the spark or are you assuming there is no spark since it didnt start?
    Lonnie
    Black 70 skylark post car (Tyler's old car)
    Yellow 72 suncoupe 350/350 8.5.
    72 chevelle with 462 buick 9-9.5-1 estimated cr stock not stage heads lunati 68001 cam 800 cfm qjet. hooker headers and spx intake. th-400. 100 shot
    8.5 3.73 posi
    3200 coan (sold)

    1.78 60 ft 12.2 at 112 mph
    no traction

    first engine i built by myself. gotta love the 3126 cat..pshht.

  5. #130
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Bathurst NB
    Posts
    930

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Turned the lights down low, played some Barry White, pulled the boot, trun engine over n watch for spark jump from plug to wire. Nuttin. Will check details tomorrow.
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  6. #131
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    Feb 2005
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    Bathurst NB
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    930

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Valve hitting piston??? I guess that really should not be there! I entered through spark plug hole, tried to line up camera as well as I could so top of pic would be @ 12 o clock. Odd that only that one would be an issue. I only checked this as this was where the noise was coming from, I checked one more on same bank looks good.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  7. #132
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    Nov 2010
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    elk city, ok
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    thats what it looks like to me. take the rocker arms up. get a straightedge and put it across the valve tips and see if that valve is low. if it is, inspect the retainer and try to gently tap it down or side to side and see if it is loose in the valve guide. something is wrong, luckily it quit sparking maybe that saved your butt on this. ask your mechanic if he checked ptv clearance. but with only 1 valve doing it. i would think that something is either wrong with the valve spring retainer and what not. i would be very unhappy at the engine builder at this point....
    Lonnie
    Black 70 skylark post car (Tyler's old car)
    Yellow 72 suncoupe 350/350 8.5.
    72 chevelle with 462 buick 9-9.5-1 estimated cr stock not stage heads lunati 68001 cam 800 cfm qjet. hooker headers and spx intake. th-400. 100 shot
    8.5 3.73 posi
    3200 coan (sold)

    1.78 60 ft 12.2 at 112 mph
    no traction

    first engine i built by myself. gotta love the 3126 cat..pshht.

  8. #133
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    elk city, ok
    Posts
    2,210

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    sorry. take the rocker arms OFF
    Lonnie
    Black 70 skylark post car (Tyler's old car)
    Yellow 72 suncoupe 350/350 8.5.
    72 chevelle with 462 buick 9-9.5-1 estimated cr stock not stage heads lunati 68001 cam 800 cfm qjet. hooker headers and spx intake. th-400. 100 shot
    8.5 3.73 posi
    3200 coan (sold)

    1.78 60 ft 12.2 at 112 mph
    no traction

    first engine i built by myself. gotta love the 3126 cat..pshht.

  9. #134
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Bathurst NB
    Posts
    930

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Man none of those tips really line up. My gauge read from 1st to last #1 cyl to#7. Including straight edge so it's the diff between each...plus only had a 12 in straight edge so would not sit accoss all...that last one is def sitting lower, but retainers look snug...

    .937, .938, .938, .944, .950, .954, .950, .980 (includes height of straight edge)


    so with .938 being my base and that last valve at the end, the suspect one being at .980 , that last valve tip is lower by .042...
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  10. #135
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Edmonton Alberta
    Posts
    13,863

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    I would get a few adjustable pushrods and use them on the noisey lifters... It is not good however as you now know it is common for machine shops to do inconsistent work because many engines have an adjustable valve train....
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________
    My book called Small Block Buick Performance covering the V6, 215, 300, 340, and Buick 350 engines will be released soon.

    http://www.v8buick.com/forumdisplay....rformance-Book
    __________________________________________________ ____________________________
    1970 Buick Skylark Turbo 350 street/strip

  11. #136
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Arlington, TX
    Posts
    303

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Equalized valve heights on the 300 engine are important. That said, my old engine was running just fine with massive differences in valve heights....at least it did until it pulled the rocker pedestals out of the aluminum heads.

    I really hope you didn't have valve contact. Any chance the cam was not degreed properly (do you have a multi-keyway crank gear?. Wouldn't a compression test be the easiest way to confirm valve/piston contact (assuming the valve is bent now)?

    You might want to take a deep breath and pull the timing cover to confirm cam timing before you run that engine... I cannot believe that you would get valve contact only due to one valve being seated lower than the others, but I haven't seen everything yet... others here have, I am sure.
    David

    '64 Skylark Convertible 300/355 Wildcat TH350 Trans

  12. #137
    No Lift is offline Platinum Level Contributor
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    What appears to be a nick in the piston doesn't seem to be in the correct spot for a valve to hit it. I would think it would be more centered between nipple and outer rim. I'm not entirely familiar with the 300.

    That being said what 11:1 pistons are they? I would think to get 11:1 out of a 300 they would have to basically be flattops and that they should have valve notches in them. That is assuming they are aftermarket. The only way to know your actual compression is to measure it. The cam you have doesn't have big lift but I'm sure from the factory it was much less. So a factory cam may have cleared factory pistons.

    Other than the .980 valve the heights look good. Even that would not be a disaster because a hydralic lifter is meant to compensate for a broad range. However the reason it may be so deep is because the valve may be bent from the possible impact. The bent valve would keep it from seating all the way.

    I'd pop the plugs out right away and do quick compression test. That will tell the tale. No need to be running it. If you have good compression then at least that is good.

    If you do have a bent valve but there are no other witness marks on any other pistons then maybe a pushrod was not seated in the rocker or lifter cup. All it takes at that point is one starter revolution to do the damage. Bent valve. Been there, done that. If you do find a bent valve I'd do a valve to piston clearance check. You need around to be safe .080".

    If it is a bent valve you will feel it as a shake to the engine as you rev it up a bit, easily by 2000 rpm.
    Mike Pesarchick
    1976 Century 455
    BPG #1572
    NE GSGN #29
    GSCA #8
    Texas Mile 164.4 MPH

  13. #138
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Bathurst NB
    Posts
    930

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Did the comp test...all good. Builder came over tonight...lifters are not holding pressure, made me bump the engine over with VC off and you can watch the rockers tip back from the spring pressure of the valve. He thought he put 5w 30 in my engine and maybe a heavier oil would resolve. He will be calling the peeps he got the lifters from... VVT?? And mentioned that he would prefer to change the lifters. At least it's not a bottom end issue and my engine does not need to come out again!

    Thanks for the guidance and input from the board members. I appreciate the help and support. Cheers.
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  14. #139
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    elk city, ok
    Posts
    2,210

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    i doubt all of the lifters are bleeding off but you never know. i would almost bet that the pushrods arent long enough.. but without seeing it for sure with my own eyes its hard to say.
    Lonnie
    Black 70 skylark post car (Tyler's old car)
    Yellow 72 suncoupe 350/350 8.5.
    72 chevelle with 462 buick 9-9.5-1 estimated cr stock not stage heads lunati 68001 cam 800 cfm qjet. hooker headers and spx intake. th-400. 100 shot
    8.5 3.73 posi
    3200 coan (sold)

    1.78 60 ft 12.2 at 112 mph
    no traction

    first engine i built by myself. gotta love the 3126 cat..pshht.

  15. #140
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    1,242

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    If the valve did hit the piston it could mean that the valve guide is too tight and the valve got stuck and hit the piston. With the lifters bleeding down I have seen this on my engine and I solved this problem with buying Comp Cams pro magnum lifters, they won't bleed down.

    Why would the engine builder use 5w-30w oil when these motors all used 13-30 oil? Also if the engine is getting that hot on break in it is because something is wrong somewhere else.

    If piston rings are causing a overheating problem then they are not set right. When my engine was on the dyno it got ran to 5500 rpm after break in and there was no overheating problem and I had replace everything in the engine.
    Bu Hogs Rock
    Guy
    355 Buick
    13.50@99 mph motor
    13.31@100 best
    11.81@114 mph 125 shot nitrous
    200-4r trans 3000 stall 373 gears
    H-O Racing suspension

    http://www.streetfire.net/video/1029...time_12508.htm
    With 350 trans 11.87@112, 125 shot nitrous

  16. #141
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    Feb 2005
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    Bathurst NB
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    930

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Running hot no longer an issue, Played some different springs that came with thrust plate kit. They preformed as indicated in the instructions, so oil pressure issues all ok. You meant 15-30 oil right? Not sure...maybe that is what he had kicking around. First start up was low on coolant, probably that was my issue or air locked??? Got it idling, sounds sweet, just need to get this lifter issue sorted out and I am good. Busy this weekend, so maybe next. Thanks.
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  17. #142
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    1,242

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Post #138 said there was 5-30 oil put in. Hope it all works out for ya. Try the Comp Cams Pro Magnum lifters if you keep having trouble with your lifters. You will have to do a new 20 minute break in period if you change them.
    Bu Hogs Rock
    Guy
    355 Buick
    13.50@99 mph motor
    13.31@100 best
    11.81@114 mph 125 shot nitrous
    200-4r trans 3000 stall 373 gears
    H-O Racing suspension

    http://www.streetfire.net/video/1029...time_12508.htm
    With 350 trans 11.87@112, 125 shot nitrous

  18. #143
    Join Date
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    elk city, ok
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    2,210

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    from my experience during the breakin if you dont have a huge fan it will overheat.. you probably did not experience this problem since most dynos probably have better cooling than a regular radiator. but im not sure. as far as v8 cars go ive always noticed they want to run a little hot till they breakin good...
    Lonnie
    Black 70 skylark post car (Tyler's old car)
    Yellow 72 suncoupe 350/350 8.5.
    72 chevelle with 462 buick 9-9.5-1 estimated cr stock not stage heads lunati 68001 cam 800 cfm qjet. hooker headers and spx intake. th-400. 100 shot
    8.5 3.73 posi
    3200 coan (sold)

    1.78 60 ft 12.2 at 112 mph
    no traction

    first engine i built by myself. gotta love the 3126 cat..pshht.

  19. #144
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    482

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Quote Originally Posted by 462 Chevelle View Post
    from my experience during the breakin if you dont have a huge fan it will overheat.. you probably did not experience this problem since most dynos probably have better cooling than a regular radiator. but im not sure. as far as v8 cars go ive always noticed they want to run a little hot till they breakin good...
    Very true. Not sure how much it really helps but you can use one of those "summertime" box fans to blow air towards the radiator as well during break in.
    Big Matt

    '65 Special w/300 V8
    '65 Skylark w/300 V8
    '66 Skylark w/430 big block
    '69 Skylark w/350
    (2) complete 455's waiting to be built

  20. #145
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    Feb 2005
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    Bathurst NB
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    930

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    I took the car out for a short ride, had good oil pressure at start up but that did not last. Once that oil got to operating temperature it would barley hold 7lbs at idle, difficulty staying ahead of the RPM curve IE I would like to see 30lbs at 2000 rmp, 40lbs at 3000 rpm, it was more respectable in the upper RPM range but scary in the lower range.

    Those of you following this thread will remember that the oil passage between the pick tube to where it turns towards the front cover was surgically removed, a new piece of cast was welded in place (cold weld) and the oil passage was re drilled. The block was stripped before it was brought to the commercial welding shop who specialize in this work. However, the cam bearings remained in the block. I talked to the shop that did the work. Comments were that those cam bearings should have been removed and all the oil passages reamed or blown clear to make sure no fillings were lodged behind the cam bearings from having drilled out the oil passage. Builder disagreed, oil passage repair was between PU tube and oil pump. However they did remove oil galley plugs, hot tanked the block and blew out all oil passages before re assembly.

    Machine Shop will be making a house call soon to replace all lifters and will inspect cam lobes, when he came by to inspect he seemed concerned with the pushrods, IE said that once the push rods are snugged that he should have a 1 turn + 1/2 till the rocker arm bolts are torqued down, mine only had a 1/2 turn left. As I am told that most of our oil pressure is generated from the cam shaft to cam bearing gap I hope I have not spun a cam bearing. Oil pressure has not been consistent.
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  21. #146
    No Lift is offline Platinum Level Contributor
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    I never heard of a block being hot tanked with the bearings in because a true hot tank uses caustic solutions which eat away bearings.

    Now if they just ran it through a hot water/steam cleaning solution that would be different.

    If it was that close to being stripped down I don't see why they didn't pop them out.
    Mike Pesarchick
    1976 Century 455
    BPG #1572
    NE GSGN #29
    GSCA #8
    Texas Mile 164.4 MPH

  22. #147
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
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    elk city, ok
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    2,210

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    agreed. and why 5.30 thats to thin when warmed up get at least 10.30 . what's cold start oil pressure
    Lonnie
    Black 70 skylark post car (Tyler's old car)
    Yellow 72 suncoupe 350/350 8.5.
    72 chevelle with 462 buick 9-9.5-1 estimated cr stock not stage heads lunati 68001 cam 800 cfm qjet. hooker headers and spx intake. th-400. 100 shot
    8.5 3.73 posi
    3200 coan (sold)

    1.78 60 ft 12.2 at 112 mph
    no traction

    first engine i built by myself. gotta love the 3126 cat..pshht.

  23. #148
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Michigan, USA
    Posts
    15,042

    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Michel, we need to know what method of "hot tanking" was used.

    We'll go from there.

    Devon
    Fuel & Brake Systems Engineer
    "I can live with doubt and uncertainty and not knowing. I think it's much more interesting to live not knowing than to have answers which might be wrong." - Feynman
    "Good data is precious. The problem I have is when some damned fool fails to use it properly." - Slingerland

  24. #149
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
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    Bathurst NB
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Sorry, if caustic is used for hot tank...builder probably would not have done that. Probably steamed...I will check and confirm. I use to run a heavier oil, once I dump this break in oil I will go back to what I had. Cold start at 55 lbs.
    Michel A Arseneau
    Bathurst, NB

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOpTC85xH067

    340 CI, .30 os, 10.25:1 pistons, 1" spacer, 4bbl, heads mild porting and matched. 100psi springs, Crower cam 50232, recurved distributor with petronix all in at 2200 rpm, ported stk exh. manifolds, 2.5 inch x2 SS Magnaflow exh, 200r4 BFR trani, 2500 Stall D5 TC, 3.23 posi trac, 2 inch drop.

    michel_arseneau@rogers.com

  25. #150
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    Sep 2004
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    Michigan, USA
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    Default Re: New Build, No Oil Pressure Om Pre Lube!

    Hoping best as always, keep us posted.

    Devon
    Fuel & Brake Systems Engineer
    "I can live with doubt and uncertainty and not knowing. I think it's much more interesting to live not knowing than to have answers which might be wrong." - Feynman
    "Good data is precious. The problem I have is when some damned fool fails to use it properly." - Slingerland

 

 
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