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  1. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Ok, I finally have the transmission separated from the engine, but not the transmission from the bell housing.

    Please see the picture. What are those rusty bolts? Do I need to remove those? It seems like a new set of bolts and what ever that plate is called (sorry, I can't find the name) would be good to replace when I rebuild the transmission.

    What is going on here?

    Did I make a mistake somewhere along the way?

    Thanks.
    Ed Green

    1967 GS-400 4 Speed

  2. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    sorry, forgot the picture:
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Ed Green

    1967 GS-400 4 Speed

  3. #28
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    19,831

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    That's the front bearing retainer. Im sure the rust is only cosmetic. As long as the area the release bearing rides on isn't grooved up, its nothing a bead blasting wont take care of if you rebuild the transmission. Apply a little heat to the bell or soak it for a few days. Once its free, drop off the bell at the machine shop for a hot tank and bead blasting. If your not rebuilding the trans, just hit the outer edge of the bearing retainer with some emory cloth to remove the rust.

    New bearing retainers are Korean or Italian made these days, just sayin

    And if you change the gear oil, use GL4 not GL5! GL5 is not compatible with yellow metals like brass
    Jason Cook
    BPG #1675
    "Expert in obsolete technology"

    1968 Riviera GS- some assembly required
    1969 Riviera GS- my first car
    1969 GS-350
    1970 Stage 1 4 speed Aquamist
    1970 GS-455 Bamboo Cream beater
    1971 GS 455 11.93@113.36
    1972 GS-350
    1970 Stellar Industries vintage go kart

    Deo duce, ferro comitante

  4. #29
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    19,831

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    And just for the record, the bearing retainer is part of the transmission. Leave those 4 bolts in place. If you already knew that, disregard
    Jason Cook
    BPG #1675
    "Expert in obsolete technology"

    1968 Riviera GS- some assembly required
    1969 Riviera GS- my first car
    1969 GS-350
    1970 Stage 1 4 speed Aquamist
    1970 GS-455 Bamboo Cream beater
    1971 GS 455 11.93@113.36
    1972 GS-350
    1970 Stellar Industries vintage go kart

    Deo duce, ferro comitante

  5. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Quote Originally Posted by buick64203 View Post
    That's the front bearing retainer. Im sure the rust is only cosmetic. As long as the area the release bearing rides on isn't grooved up, its nothing a bead blasting wont take care of if you rebuild the transmission. Apply a little heat to the bell or soak it for a few days. Once its free, drop off the bell at the machine shop for a hot tank and bead blasting. If your not rebuilding the trans, just hit the outer edge of the bearing retainer with some emory cloth to remove the rust.

    New bearing retainers are Korean or Italian made these days.

    And if you change the gear oil, use GL4 not GL5! GL5 is not compatible with yellow metals like brass
    Thanks Jason. I don't have a torch. Is that what you mean by heat, or just a heat gun? Soak in what? I sprayed the bolts with some penetrating oil.

    Sorry for my ignorance, but I still don't understand what is holding it on to the bell?

    I will be rebuilding the transmission.
    Ed Green

    1967 GS-400 4 Speed

  6. #31
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    19,831

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Spray around the diameter of the rusty bearing retainer with penetrating oil. Again, the bolts don't get removed! That whole rusty part is part of the transmission. Soak it for a few days and give the bell a few taps with a dead blow hammer (named after an ex girlfriend of mine). You may have to tap it back and forth a few times to work the penetrating oil in between the steel and aluminum

    You should invest in a small torch. Even if its just a "plumbers torch" which is just acetylene. Its indispensable when taking apart stuff that's been together for 50 years
    Jason Cook
    BPG #1675
    "Expert in obsolete technology"

    1968 Riviera GS- some assembly required
    1969 Riviera GS- my first car
    1969 GS-350
    1970 Stage 1 4 speed Aquamist
    1970 GS-455 Bamboo Cream beater
    1971 GS 455 11.93@113.36
    1972 GS-350
    1970 Stellar Industries vintage go kart

    Deo duce, ferro comitante

  7. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    19,831

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Quote Originally Posted by NZ GS 400 View Post
    Sorry for my ignorance, but I still don't understand what is holding it on to the bell?

    I will be rebuilding the transmission.

    Luckily for you, I just happen to have a bellhousing and bearing retainer handy in my basement parts dept. All that's holding it together is rust. Probably a combination of alumimun corrosion and plain old rust!

    In my left hand is a Muncie bearing retainer (similarly rusty) and a "581" bellhousing next to it. The bearing retainer which is attached to the trans just slips into the big hole in the bell

    20161217_234651[1].jpg
    Jason Cook
    BPG #1675
    "Expert in obsolete technology"

    1968 Riviera GS- some assembly required
    1969 Riviera GS- my first car
    1969 GS-350
    1970 Stage 1 4 speed Aquamist
    1970 GS-455 Bamboo Cream beater
    1971 GS 455 11.93@113.36
    1972 GS-350
    1970 Stellar Industries vintage go kart

    Deo duce, ferro comitante

  8. #33
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Awesome man! Thanks. I was out squirting oil on the diameter of the bearing retainer just now. I did NOT remove the bolts...

    I will get one of those small torches. I will need one for the rebuild, if nothing else...but I am sure there will be lots else.

    Thanks again for your help Jason.
    Ed Green

    1967 GS-400 4 Speed

  9. #34
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    19,831

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    No problem...here to help
    Jason Cook
    BPG #1675
    "Expert in obsolete technology"

    1968 Riviera GS- some assembly required
    1969 Riviera GS- my first car
    1969 GS-350
    1970 Stage 1 4 speed Aquamist
    1970 GS-455 Bamboo Cream beater
    1971 GS 455 11.93@113.36
    1972 GS-350
    1970 Stellar Industries vintage go kart

    Deo duce, ferro comitante

  10. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Bucks County, Pa
    Posts
    6,528

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    You CAN remove the bolts for the bearing retainer to disconnect bell from trans.... retainer would still be stuck in the bellhousing but it will be easier to soak with solvent and work that retainer loose.
    Walt K
    (1)'66 GS Astro Blue, 13.41 et (2)'66 GS Saddle Mist, L76 Q-jet option, 1 of 132 (3)'66 GS Flame Red, Calif car (4)'66 GS Silver Mist, 4 speed (5)'66 Special, Flame Red, 300 (6)'79 Turbo Regal, 14.1 et (7)'65 GS 4 speed 'vert

  11. #36
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    19,831

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Quote Originally Posted by wkillgs View Post
    You CAN remove the bolts for the bearing retainer to disconnect bell from trans.... retainer would still be stuck in the bellhousing but it will be easier to soak with solvent and work that retainer loose.
    I was just worried about him ruining the gasket if he wasn't doing anything with the transmission. One can of worms at a time!
    Jason Cook
    BPG #1675
    "Expert in obsolete technology"

    1968 Riviera GS- some assembly required
    1969 Riviera GS- my first car
    1969 GS-350
    1970 Stage 1 4 speed Aquamist
    1970 GS-455 Bamboo Cream beater
    1971 GS 455 11.93@113.36
    1972 GS-350
    1970 Stellar Industries vintage go kart

    Deo duce, ferro comitante

  12. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Bucks County, Pa
    Posts
    6,528

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Quote Originally Posted by buick64203 View Post
    I was just worried about him ruining the gasket if he wasn't doing anything with the transmission. One can of worms at a time!
    I'm thinking removing the stuck bearing retainer from the bell would be far easier with the retainer/bell removed from the trans....... therefore the time/hassle would far outweigh the cost of a gasket/schmasket!
    I haven't dealt with a stuck b.r./bell, so I defer final judgement to those that have.
    Walt K
    (1)'66 GS Astro Blue, 13.41 et (2)'66 GS Saddle Mist, L76 Q-jet option, 1 of 132 (3)'66 GS Flame Red, Calif car (4)'66 GS Silver Mist, 4 speed (5)'66 Special, Flame Red, 300 (6)'79 Turbo Regal, 14.1 et (7)'65 GS 4 speed 'vert

  13. #38
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Thanks for weighing in Walt, I am going to wait a couple days and see if the penetrating oil does indeed penetrate and loosen 'er up. I am in no immediate rush.

    I will be rebuilding, so gasket damage is not a concern, thanks for that thought Jason.

    I will keep you guys informed of any "breaking" news!
    Ed Green

    1967 GS-400 4 Speed

  14. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    632

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Quote Originally Posted by buick64203 View Post
    Luckily for you, I just happen to have a bellhousing and bearing retainer handy in my basement parts dept. All that's holding it together is rust. Probably a combination of alumimun corrosion and plain old rust!

    In my left hand is a Muncie bearing retainer (similarly rusty) and a "581" bellhousing next to it. The bearing retainer which is attached to the trans just slips into the big hole in the bell

    20161217_234651[1].jpg
    Luckily for situations like this, legend has it that most of the GS parts ever made likely reside in Jason's basement

  15. #40
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    19,831

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dano View Post
    Luckily for situations like this, legend has it that most of the GS parts ever made likely reside in Jason's basement
    I try You got some real hoarders on this site.
    Jason Cook
    BPG #1675
    "Expert in obsolete technology"

    1968 Riviera GS- some assembly required
    1969 Riviera GS- my first car
    1969 GS-350
    1970 Stage 1 4 speed Aquamist
    1970 GS-455 Bamboo Cream beater
    1971 GS 455 11.93@113.36
    1972 GS-350
    1970 Stellar Industries vintage go kart

    Deo duce, ferro comitante

  16. #41
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    632

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Quote Originally Posted by buick64203 View Post
    I try You got some real hoarders on this site.
    I used to be until I liquidated everything and figured when I did that I'd just never do another project. Now I'm playing catchup all over again. I'd imagine this need to hoard stems from us who remember when nothing was available for our cars and parts cars were plentiful.

  17. #42
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Update: I got the bell housing loose! No need to remove the bolts from the retainer. Just needed to soak a couple days and a few love taps from my rubber mallet.

    thanks again guys!
    Ed Green

    1967 GS-400 4 Speed

  18. #43
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Sacramento CA area
    Posts
    3,656

    Default Re: Pulling Muncie from bell housing? It doesn't want to come out.

    Come-alongs have been employed in the past.
    BadBrad
    '70 GS455 - Power Brute Super T10 4spd
    ex. '70 GSX
    New Project: 2000 Mercury Grand Marquis - for the kids to drive.
    New Muscle: 2013 Ford Taurus SHO - Twin Turbo Terror

    Spare 455 on the stand, just in case!


    Slideshow of BadBrad's Car: http://s517.photobucket.com/albums/u...view=slideshow

 

 
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