I don't want ac on my 1964 425 or my 1963 401. The 425 pump is seized but it definetly came out of a ac car. Not sure about the 401. Will I be ok putting on non ac pumps
I believe the only difference in the pump is a couple of extra fins on the impeller. The pully might be different but I would stick with an ac pump just for the extra cooling capability even if I had to hunt another down.
I've been reading a lot of forums around this website and many have said the ac pumps don't cool as well because they push too fast because of the extra vains/blades. Others have also talked about putting an ac pump on an original non ac motor which would cause a leak. I havent heard anyone trying the way I want to do it. Just trying to get some more knowledge and info so I dont mess up my motas.
With the 401/425 engines there were ''long nose and short nose'' pumps.... and the difference between ac and non-ac is the impeller... the ac impeller having 5 vanes.... and the ac cars uses a smaller dia pulley with 2 groves to spin the pump faster.... A water ''pump'' aint really a pump it just stirs the water in a certain direction... not like a oil pump which is a true pump..... the way to not run hot is to have more than enough radiator to cool the car, sitting in traffic, in gear, on the hottest day of summer.... with a fan shroud and heavy duty fan....7 blade.... :Brow:and a good thermostat.... 180 deg. or so..... the best set up is to change the thermostat in the spring to a 160 deg... and then back to the hot thermostat in the late fall....that is what the factory reccomended back in the day.....and,,,,, check and keep the upper hose and the lower hose and the HEATER HOSES AND BY PASS HOSES good... i have seen more engines burned up because of failed heater and by pass hoses than any other cause.....if a woman happens to be driving when they fail, they will keep driving untill they get to where they are going or the engine locks up ......:Brow::laugh: some guys will.... but most women will.... and i would rather that they did.... to keep something bad from happening to them.... so the best thing to do is keep the system in real good order and the problem will not happen to start with.....
Anyone running electric fans? I have had really goodluck with dual and single pusher fans, wire up a thermo switch and set it and forget it. For my turbo setup I bought a huge aluminum radiator, so big that I had to drop my lower support 5 inches but I never had a issue with overheating. I just bought a universal aluminum for my jeep that I am putting a ls1 in it and I spent $180 on a nice aluminum unit. Little black paint to hide its aluminum and no one will know.
Thanks. I appreciate the input. that's a lot of good info ill use. I'm not tryin to be a dick but my original question hasn't been answered. Will non-ac water pumps work on a original factory ac motor? Will it cause a leak? Could I use the ac pully on the non-ac pump to just turn the three vains faster?
yes non-ac will work with a ac motor, no way it will cause a leak,all the timing chain covers are the same on ac and non-ac, thats where the water pump bolts to. you can change pullys it will just change the ratio, the fan belt would need more adjustment to take the slack up for the smaller pully
The non-ac pump will work as long as it is the same length (from the pulley flange to the mounting surface) as the ac pump. You can use the ac pump pulley as a replacement for the non-ac pulley. You may need to switch to a shorter drive belt. I agree with almost everything Doc says. My only difference with his post is that I would not switch to the 160 thermostat. If your radiator is of adequate size - and I agree with his huge radiator philosophy - and you run a 180 thermostat, the engine should run at 180. My 425-Nailhead powered Chevy pickup uses the enormous Diesel radiator, a viscous fan, and the Diesel shroud. You cannot make it overheat. I would tow a 5,000 lb trailer across Death Valley in high summer and not worry about cooling. FWIW: Mine has the ac pump, pulley, and does have air conditioning. Even if my daily driver was a '33 Buick, I would air condition it.
Bitchen!!! Thanks so much y'all. You think my original 50 pontiac radiator will work. It weighs a ton and it was cooling the original straight very nicely ---------- Post added at 09:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:32 AM ---------- Straight 8
I had a hard time with my original (re-cored) radiator, in very hot weather. For the 322 there is only one water pump, (for A/C and non A/C, mine is non A/C). But, an A/C car has a 13psi radiator cap vs. a 7psi cap for the nonA/C car. So, I put two quarts of water wetter and a 13psi cap and I haven't had trouble since.....
Dirk,,,, what you have to have is a radiator that is clean inside and out and of solid construction.... and yes on a lot of the older cars they had radiators with enough volume to cool anything.... i had a 49 ford that more than cooled the big tbird engine that i put in it.... it is the later ones that are marginal.... but,,, that said,,,, your original radiator will have to be clean inside and out for it to work... no radiator will work if it is plugged up..... so know for a fact that it is in good shape.... and if possible use a good shroud....
Alright. Sounds good. I've flushed the holy crap out of the raditor once before and two other times jus for the heck of it. Clear fluid/water always comes out. Thanks doc. Thanks bulldog.
If you are ever having a hard time getting them clean use draino and let it sit. Have done it a bunch of times with clogged heater cores in jeep Cherokees. Actually did two in the last three weeks.
Can anyone comment on Water Wetter and similar products. I put two bottles in mine and I am not really sure if it works or not. Seems like it may have cooled a couple of degrees or so. Also some guy told me that thicker oil will also help run a little cooler. Like 20-50. Of course that was the Amsoil guy trying to sell me oil. So I tried it. Didn't seem to do anything. I run about 210 when temp is over 100. But it seems to hold steady regardless of stop and go and idling through a show and shine.
with a stock sized radiator, 210 in 100 + weather without thermal creep is not bad.....basicly, as long as the system keeps liquid in it, you are good to go... the oil does cool an engine a lot.... so the guy is kind of right.... but it aint the thickness that matters , it is the total amount of oil in the sump.... i have a oil temp gage in my car and on the interstate 260 or so deg is common....
Doc is correct - when you think about it, The engine oil is the only thing that cools the rotating and reciprocating parts of an engine. I remember a GM engineer (Oldsmobile Division) telling me that in a typical OHV V8 engine at any one instant, one teaspoon of oil was doing all of the lubricating. The rest was acting as a coolant. If you are having cooling problems and have a large radiator, give some thought to an oil cooler.
Hi, There were more variations of water pumps and one 1 posibily 2 will cause a leak at the timing cover, ealry 364 and 401's had different timing covers and a shorter section on pump, they look close, but one is about the width of the gasket short, as friend with a 60-401 pionted it out and it was orginally a long nose pump and he installed a short one off a 57-364, but was different than the 64-66 variety I had sitting on my shelf if you get a full engine gasket set you will see there are 2 waterpump gaskets Maybe someone here know the exact breakdown of when they changed, also there was a cast iron timing cover as well so not sure if there are more varities out there good luck
The 401 in my 63 Wildcat ran 180-190 UNTIL I installed an A/C, complete with the smaller pulley. Now it runs 200-210 without the A/C on. I'm assuming I'll need to change the water pump to the A/C version as soon as I get a chance.
