This car is awesome! Anybody know anything about it? Believe me, I can’t afford it. https://www.legendarymotorcar.com/inventory/1970-buick-gs-stage-1-2240.aspx
Those guys have some really special cars. After the gsx reunion in 2009 I stopped in on the way home with my X and they gave me a personal tour of the facility. High end cars and customers they said Buick’s are a hard sell. Very nice and rare gs there, hope they get the money.
Some "interesting" discussion about it here: http://www.v8buick.com/index.php?threads/70-stage-1-4-sp-convertible.362339/
As Paul Harvey used to say "And now, for the rest of the story" Your basing this whole "non numbers" motor on the fact that CrashKline, the original flipper on this car, stated it had a SF engine block in it.. actually it was a 73 XF engine.. I suspect that you could only clearly see the last digit of the two digit stamp, so he assumed it was a 70 SF motor. He only ever had one picture of the car, I wonder if he every really saw the thing. You would think he would take a bunch of pics, but many of these flippers look to turn these cars, without even moving them. Costs money to transport, and they often see if they can sell it again, where it sits. Since he only has the one pic, I would suspect that was the case with this one. Secondly, what the flipper was not telling you, is that he could not get the trunk open, and low and behold, when the trunk was finally opened, there were 4 sets of heads, and the original block. All that crap bouncing around back there wreaked havoc on the sheetmetal, and the trunk pan and seat back divider had to be replaced. Third.. that stamping number has been inspected by the top judges in the Buick world, to my knowledge not one of them had any issue with it.. and neither do I.. looks fine to me, I see goofy stamps on these things all the time.. And finally, and most importantly, Joe Castrigano, who restored this car, has a reputation in our community that is beyond question.. just like most guys in this business, he is not about to try and restamp an engine.... and if he had, he certainly would have spread the S.... S code out on the block, like we most often see. But I have certainly seen them stamped that way from Flint before, that is, with the letters together. We all have, if you have looked at enough samples. I think you will find that everyone who owns one of Joe's restos, will attest to his honesty. I have done a few resto engine and trans builds for him, and he insists on authentic stuff, when ever it can be found. He has never even hinted about doing anything shady. JW
I never said it wasn't the correct block nor did I ever question Joe's reputation. It's your site so I'll leave it there.
I don't believe I ever accused you, or anyone else of anything.. just trying to clarify the history of that particular vehicle. JW
You've got the wrong person Joe. Never met you but if we had, I'm one of the nicest people you'd ever meet, I go out of my way in this hobby to help people, & I'm just here for our common interest in these cars - That's all. I try to post relevant content about these cars & have railed against ppl deviating from that regarding "certain topics" on this site. I simply posted a link to a car being for sale. There was discussion & someone else linked to when the car was originally for sale which did question the legitimacy of the engine. I even posted that it would be well worth someone's effort to find said original block - It does happen & the current seller listed it as "numbers matching." I then posted another link to the car being previously for sale that had a picture of the stamp on the block that miraculously had somehow been found. Turns out there was a good explanation for that but nobody else at that time stepped up w/any further comments, the explanation shared above, pictures, the "super secret" 3 digit "code but not a date code" (that would've said a lot), etc., etc. My only derogatory comment was regarding the changing of an original option. There was ample opportunity to "clear the air" in that thread yet nobody did so. Edit: I'd forgotten that the 3 digit code is shown in the pic w/the "SS" stamp. What didn't mention as an alleged pot stirrer was that the first S IMHO looks like an upside down 5 & that I couldn't imagine anyone doing that on purpose on a re-stamp. What I also didn't mention in my post again, as an alleged pot stirrer, was that in my (albeit limited) experience, the code seemed inconsistent w/the build date of the car. I just figured I'd see where the discussion went based on the pics of the stampings rather than inject my opinion since there are others that are more of an expert in that regard than I am. If that's "stirring the pot" then guilty as charged. The discussion didn't ensue and I dropped it. In another post I even gave the benefit of the doubt, based on the price & before I posted the 2nd link, that the orig. block was reunited with the car. All I did ask was how one goes about getting a Wayne Roberts & Sloan on the same car which based on my understanding of how that all works, isn't possible and so that fact (they're both pictured) added to the mystery? Again, if that's stirring the pot to ask what I thought was a legitimate question than so be it. All that said, if all the experts have looked at it, as Jim said, & say it's legit, than congratulations on finding what was akin to a $50k lottery ticket in the trunk. You certainly do beautiful work and have a stellar reputation. You quoted my post, which linked to a thread I started, and then started your post with "Your (sic)" & then said "you" 2 more times in your post. Words have meaning/context so not sure how else I was supposed to interpret that but fair enough. Glad I misinterpreted & that it wasn't being directed at me.
For what its worth there are more than a few people here who knew the pertinent details on the car in 2010 when it was completed 10 years ago.Since then it spent a good bit of time in a large exclusive collection in Ohio.Many here also know by whom who by the way owned said car twice."Pot stirrers"to me are some folks who like clock work blow apart any Buick that comes for sale anywhere and it seems like they all get linked here.Just seems to me that some of it is uncalled for.The part that bothered me the most believe it or not was the comment about the battery topper which is also a prime example of what I mention here about some folks and their mouths.If youve tried lately to buy one of the 3oo plus dollar batteries you may know they have been difficult to obtain as of late.Could explain why it has what it has for a battery.I think alot of folks might agree with my point whether they admit it or not.I dont come on much as I'm pretty busy these days.But its been hard watching this thread .I wont go back and forth it is what it is.I prefer to continue to think of this as the go to Buick site.Not trying to start anything.But I'll only sit on my hands for so long.
Joe if you're the one to restored the car you did a beautiful job I hope the car gets every bit of 185,000. As far as a battery topper that's not a dealbreaker to me there's a lot more important parts to go into a restoration of one of these cars than a battery.
Thank You! Its held up well for 10 years .Believe it or not the past owner would drop the top and roll!
Fwiw, I don't think I fall into that "pot stirrer" category or at least I try not to (obviously the battery topper comment wasn't mine). I post links to cars once in a while (always initially w/o comment) only b/c someone here may be interested in it. This car in particular led to some interesting and totally unexpected discussion as I'd not been on here much if at all during that time period. I didn't tear the car apart (honestly there isn't much to tear apart in this case) and generally don't do so to much extent. I do think it's the nature of the beast on any car site to do what happens here and in many cases it's in a way a service to any prospective buyer. In this case, all I said was that I'd have preferred to see it optioned as original wrt the mirror & radio (IIRC) and even agreed re: your decision to delete the body side moldings (again going off memory). I was looking for opinions on the stampings & questioned having both reports. As much as I like originality I'm going to do the same on my '71 GS convertible wrt the moldings (body side door edge) & bumper guards and to be admittedly hypocritical here, going to probably delete the radio and remote mirror from my already very low option '70 350 4-sp. I don't come here to get into battle and in fact just the opposite and have made a lot of friends here but felt as though I was being unfairly accused by you and Jim in this case & felt the need to defend myself. As we didn't exactly get off on the right foot here, hopefully we'll get a chance to meet sometime & put all this behind.
To add a perspective.... How many stories have been told on this (and every car forum) in which an original part was mysteriously found either in a barn, junkyard, boat, truck, another car, another country, etc? Is it possible? Yes... But highly unlikely and rightfully so, skeptical. This story, a known flipper (Crashklein) never opened the trunk (odd) and sold the car. When the next person brought it home and opened the trunk, the original engine was there.. Possible, yes. Skeptical? Highly. That is what is being expressed in all of the posts in regards to this car. As both the restorer (Joe) and Jim have pointed out, this is that 1 in a thousand cases where yes, the original engine which was thought to be lost was actually found, and reunited with the car. Again, there will always be a level of skepticism based on a host of not-so-honest restampers who tell this same story. No pot stirring, just plain fact.
Throw in the pot the fact that crashklein was arrested indicted by feds on autotheft,fraud and forgery charges.
I don't know if I'm a "pot stirrer" or not. It is an excellent resto, Joe...there's no question about it. I'm aware of your rep, and spoke with you in BG. IMHO the description was way over the top, you just don't flaunt that a car has a "Battery Topper", or a Saginaw steering box. Yes, I'm totally aware of the difficulty of getting "real" batteries right now. I'm lucky to have them in my own 3 cars. I'm also aware that the company that's selling the car now manufactures those Battery Toppers, and they wrote the description, not you. So, I've got a sense of what's going on with that. I wasn't trying to say that the resto was not well done, or you cut corners. The numbers? I wasn't implying that you had re-stamped it. It's just when I researched the Klein guy, it seemed odd, and I was curious about it. It is, what it is. I call them as I see them, if that makes me a "pot stirrer" then I guess I am.
yes way to much of this. its just part of the hobby like a cancer that cant be stopped. there are cowl plates, vin tags, stamps, and everything you need to fake a legit looking car that even the EXPERTS cannot tell the difference. imho only unrestored cars and long time known cars are blue chip value. charlie,,,
You got to love some of the ads that we've seen where the owner has owned the car for five years. I have seen four ads in a row saying that give me a break. ( Flipper) True Buick guy hold onto their cars, the collectors are the ones that sell them when they get bored like in six months. So if you're looking for a car you need to find a long-term owner. Someday someone will have the chance to own such a car when I decide to sell. It's not a concourse car but it is a numbers matching and verifiable with paperwork.
