You really can’t compare the actual pumps to each other, they are very different in design. Which one is better? I think comparing the entire engine oiling system design is more applicable vs just comparing the pump. I’m not saying the BBC oiling system is better than the BBB however I do know that a ton of time and $ go into fixing the BBB oiling system to increase engive longevity. I’m not sure if the BBC guys have the same level of challenge.
Thanks Sean. I read that people experience the Buick pump itself getting weaker after many miles and in a cold climate. Others call it a weak pump. I am asking cause i would like to know if it is just an opinion or a fact? Also i would like to know/learn if the BBC could have the same "problems" with that pump/gear set in certain conditions after so many miles.
Not an expert on this but I would say no. The int oil pump housing on the BBC is steel. Ours is alum. Steel on steel should last longer/ less wear
The biggest difference between the 2 pumps is that the 454 uses a cast iron bolt on pump. It bolts on near the rear main cap INSIDE the oil pan. The Buick oil pump is part of the ALUMINUM timing chain cover. https://www.v8buick.com/index.php?threads/oil-pump-clearances-and-oil-pressure.326597/
It is not a weaker pump. It's actually the same design, two gears spinning in a pocket. The 454 pump is all cast iron. The Buick pocket is integral to the timing chain cover. The gears are steel. Aluminum expands at a different rate than cast iron. The clearances in the Buick pump increase more than than the Chevy pump. That is why it is important to pay attention to the cold clearances. As far as longevity is concerned, if you change your oil when you need to, the Buick pump will last a good long time.
I would say yes. The timing chain cover would be a lot heavier if it was cast iron. I don't think longevity is a problem if you change your oil on time.
The biggest disadvantage to the Buick V6, 350 and 400, 430, 455 is the distance the oil must travel to get to the pump, up the pick up tube, along the block to the front where the pump is. Pumps that are "in the pan" the oil travels mere inches to the pump. After oil prime is established in the Buick type oil system, its a relatively trouble free reliable oil system for what it was ORIGINALLY designed to do. Yeah we have the front cam bearing issue, and oil passages smaller than what we'd like, but Chevy's have the rear main cap that can get distorted if you dont bolt the oil pump on properly. Every engine has different issues
Okay, so maybe in that period of time the Buick system was a bit more advanced when it comes to materials being used?
It would be so awesome if we could adapt a crank driven gerotor type pump like the 3800 and LS motors use.
Buick was way ahead of the game in the weight savings Dept. back in the day. Aluminum blocks, heads, engine covers, brackets, etc. Everyone’s “darling” the LS, borrows a lot of tech from the Buick V8’s, block (Deep skirt like the 350) tall skinny intake ports on the heads, the oiling system on the LS is similar to Buick EXCEPT the pump is crank driven. BUUUUUT, the pump is aluminum and the gears are steel, sound familiar
I know I’m quoting you twice but I gotta say this, I honestly think Buick should bow out of the car game today, there offerings are nothing more than rebadged “corporate” offerings today. GM reaped all the techno stuff from Buick then left the division out to dry Buick blazed the trail with turbo’s, how often you hear Buick getting cred for the “Turbo craze” these past few years?……….. you don’t Buick started in ‘77 ‘78 with the carbed turbo V6, Eh it was better than nothing, then it advanced to the ‘86 ‘87 sequential injection (industry first) distributor less ignition (another industry first) inter cooling, factory oil cooler, crank mounted fan gir the inter cooler front mounted scoop and ducting directly to the inter cooler, and all sorts of electronic stuff to control everything. The car was so badass and quick GM put a stop to it, “Buick can’t have a faster car than the Corvette” Buick was actually screwing with the Chevy division, Chevy advertised their 350 at 230 hp, Buick advertised their 3.8 Turbo at 235 hp in ‘86 In ‘87 Chevy advertised their 350 at 240 hp, Buick advertised their 3.8 Turbo at 245 hp, when in fact Buick was underrating their power output. So the WHOLE Buick division was treated like a red headed stepchild.
Urban Legend.. The oiling issues were never really a problem with the pump. Every wannabe-engineer magazine writer took one look at the pump when they first came out, it was different, so they pronounced it no good. That myth lives to this day, you just saw it repeated. The location of the pump out of the oil pan is a bigger concern that the design. But, as has been noted in this thread, the new LS engines have exactly the same long pickup/alumium housing pump. Gear/rotor or gears not really that much difference, that's more for packaging than function. The oiling system issues (especially with the 400/430 motors) were size limitations in the supply and pressure sides of the housings/castings, that are relatively easily modified. The rocker oiling thru the block on the early motors was a bad deal if you did not stay on top of your oil maintenance. All these things added together gave this engine family a bad rep, right from the get-go. From 71 up, the system as produce by the factory, is plenty fine for stock applications. Once modified, the Buick oiling system works just fine for most performance applications. JW
Yes, here we have had and still have the Opel Insignia which wasn't a big hit in sales. I know there is the same model as in Buick in the USA....probably not very popular too i imagine.
