Not mine just thought some one may be interested.don't seem like a bad deal.It's in the all vehicals classifeds on team chevelle website. Here the # 856-220-5217 It's in NJ.
Where's all the pictures?? The guy has no posts on the Chevelle web site and just has a car for sale? He may be as honest as all get out, but it doesn't inspire a lot of confidence.
Could be a 15k Cutlass pieced together (we all know what that means) being passed off as a R2. That is so common, it's the first thing that any one thinks on these if you don't have the pedigree back to the original owner and can verify it. New number of R2's built. :laugh: :laugh: If they built any more than the 500 special build (where mine came from) I sure never knew about it.........and I lived on that assembly line (my job) 12/day, 6 days a week except at new model launch when it went to 7 days a week. Sometimes got paid for the O.T. o No: o No:
I'm not picking on you Paul for searching out the link, I'm just gun shy from all the scammers on the internet selling things they dont have and dont even have pictures of. I get especially wary when the seller (or even the person telling us about something on some other web site) has just registered that day and starts off by pushing something we can get if we just call this number and spend (too little) money. If we were to hear the same story from someone with a track record and a little history, the feeling would be a little different. I get the same feeling on e-bay when I see a high dollar piece for sale by a seller with a -0- feedback. I realize everyone has to start somewhere, but I dont want to be the first victim.....
I know, John. Just breakin' yer ba!!s. :bla: Look at it this way, if it was a really good piece, pics and docs would be shown up front. (on any ad) It's going to be interesting to see where it all shakes out.
Hey guys my name is micheal clayton .I just put the car up here because it seemed like a buy .The car seems like it would be a good pure stocker.the car is not mine or nor do I know the owner.I my self don't like ads with no pic, I felt like if someone lived close it might be worth checking out.I mint no harm.I see here your coming from.
Hey micheal clayton, No harm done. The angst was not at you, but the seller without proof. You are more than welcome to hang around. We Buick guys will rub off on you.:beer Eventually you will buy a Buick, win the lottery and die a happy man. :laugh: Even if that doesn't all happen you will be driving a Buick. Hang around.
Here is some info on W31's if anyone is interested and may help answer some questions. It appears the "Ram Rod" was 1968 only and the W31 the successor in 1969 (& 1970). (pasted in part from: http://www.442.com/oldsfaq/ofwmc.htm)
I didn't intend this to get this detailed and long. Have toyed with the idea of writing a small book on this from time to tiime. That'll probably never happen, so here it is. If boring to you, just skip over it. There's more to the story, but I get into arguments every time I say anything about that.....also the same reason I won't take my car to the OCA shows anymore...but some of it isn't for public knowledge and could never be verified. It came directly from the people involved and some of it witnessed personally. Not something you put in print, and I won't. It had to do with why Olds released the Ramrod in the first place (never intended for production) and the inner GM challenge by another division that resulted in its immediate release in time for the 68 Springnationals. There's a few errors and omissions in this writeup from 442.com. I offerred to help them amend them after I heard about this, but they weren't interested. That has resulted in most serious Olds officionados not using the 442.com info as gospel truth on these and other cars. This info is at least 10 years old and not much was known about them back then. All in all, not a bad summary, probably the most complete one I've seen and even has the build figure more in line with how many were actually produced on line. There were so few of these around in later years, especially the 68's since most ended up as race cars and were chopped up and destroyed early in life. They weren't heavily promoted and around and only insiders knew about them before their debut at the 1968 NHRA Springnationals where they cleaned up. 69's and 70's were much more well known and some of the info applies to the 68's. But some of the stuff that happened on the 68's did not happen on the 69's and 70's or any other W car. Olds marketing kinda let that remain unspoken and took advantage of spreading it across all the Olds performance models. 1968: Authentication: Special carb number 7028255. F-85 W-31 "Ram Rod". I believe Olds only produced 501 of them. There were 5 or 6 more, but were standard Cutlasses built on line, but modified at the Olds Experimental garage ahead of the 500 car production run for test and development cars. Most notable of those 5 was the 2 tone green F85 coupe in all the magazine articles back then and also the one shown in the Motion Markowitz ads. VERY fast car, and the one I got a chance to take around the block :Brow: :laugh: and resulted in my changing my first new car order from a loaded 442 convertible to the Ramrod I still have and race in Pure Stock. A couple of the innaccuracies and incomplete info are: Technically, the W-31 was only built in 1969 and 1970. While not called a W-31, the equivalent vehicle was available and called the "Ram Rod 350" in 1968. It wasn't an equivalent vehicle, the option code for the Ramrod was W31. It was only called that after the marketing/promo guys got into the act for the 1969 model year with the "Dr Oldsmobile" promo program. It was still called a Ramrod like the fender decals all through the 68 year including the Smothers brothers cars. Unfortunately, the marketing/promo guys got carried away and tried to cash in on the Ramrod reputation from the drag racing successes starting in the Springnationals of 1968 and throughout that summer. They put "Ramrod" decals on the air cleaners of not only the W31 in 1969, but also the W30 and W32 with a "Ramrod 400" designation. The W30's needed all the help they could get after the word was out on the disappointing performance of the small bore/long stroke 400 G blaock that came out in 1968. The 65-67 442's also used a 400, but it was a smaller bore 425 with the shorter stroke and were very fast. One of the ways that you can help 'identify' a W-31 is that they used a lot less sound deadening material to save some weight. Close the trunk lid. If it sounds nice and solid and tight, that isn't a good sign. But it MAY have been replaced, so this is not a guarantee. If it sounds hollow, like you're clanging an empty steel trash can, then this will signify a W-trunk lid. Also, the firewall pad, if it is original, is very thin compared to non-Ws. B.S. A few of the early cars were designated to be racecars from the start and were funneled out to the dealer sponsored race teams and independents that had factory backing (lots of it). These cars were built on a special "red border" engineering release rather than the regular production release. Most of the first batch of 50 (Jan, 1968) and all of the 450 cars (balance of the 500 car build) had normal non A/C sound deadening and firewall pads. Exclusive to the W-31 was a special bend in the fuel line near the fuel pump. It's WHERE the bend occurs that determines the W-31. The W-31's have the bend clamped to the frame after the plate that is welded between the channels of the frame, whereas non-W-31's have the bend clamped to the frame on that plate. More B.S., but with explanation. This clip was added to the preproduction on line built cars (we called them pilot cars) and "mules" built in the engineering garage but eliminated before the 500 unit production build. The Ramrods used the 442 3/8 inch fuel line system which was 3/8 in main fuel with a return line. All other 350 cars used a 5/16 inch line with a fuel return line on A/C vehicles only. My guess is they hand fitted the 3/8 inch line on one of the mules and determined they needed that bend and clip. Not sure how they did it, but it was gone before we built the 500 on line. The car should have front AND rear sway bars with boxed lower rear control arms like the 4-4-2. Again, wrong on the Ramrods, but correct on the 69 and 70's. The 68 did have the same front sway bar and spring/shock usage as the 442, but standard Cutlass rear suspension without the sway bar. It was a glitch in the way the computer released the FE2 heavy duty suspension option on the Cutlasses. It was done by the model series of the car not the W31 package. The 442's were a separate model designation starting in 1968 (and lasted through 1971). The rear arms and sway bar were part of the 442 suspension package. This was an oversight and corrected for the 1969 model year. Most of us added these to our Ramrods as it was night and day difference in the handling, but dubious advantage in drag racing. Individual air bags negated any advantage of the rear bars and the boxed arms and sway bar only added to the unsprung weight of the rear suspension....that was a real problem in all the 67-70 type O axles and why they developed and offerred the W27 aluminum housing and cover for the 1970 model year (only year used). Pretty and unique, but fell apart under racing conditions. Cover only remained available, but didn't fit the new 8.5 corporate axles that came out in 1971. Aftermarket has them now for that 8.5 and also the 12 bolt Chev axle. Exhaust manifolds were the same as the standard 350. But BOTH exhaust pipes and mufflers were 2 1/4" inlets (2" outlet). Again partially correct and incomplete. 68's did not have the 2 1/4 inch LH head pipe (and muffler inlet), but used the standard 2 inch pipe on the drivers side that was released in the N10 dual exhaust option package. LH exhaust manifold outlet was still 2 inch like the N10's. 1969 and 1970 used special low restriction (W30) mufflers. Louder and much less restrictive. Didn't make much difference on the W31 or the 68 W30 cars due to the restrictive exhaust manifolds used on them. The W/Z big block dual exhaust manifolds came out in 1969 and then the mufflers were effective. They were much better flowing and chambered on the center two cylinders on each side. All W31 and W32 engine packages were designed to take full advantage of aftermarket headers as most everyone that was serious about Olds performance back then put them on immediately. The W31's gained about 25 horsepower over the cast iron exhaust manifolds and explained most of the difference between the advertised hp of these engines (325 at 5600) and the actual of closer to 400 with open headers with no other changes. The headers took advantage of the much higher RPM's where it really got fun on these. Additional information: Not mentioned (and probably unknown to the providers of this info at the time) were that the 68 Ramrods did not come with a fan shroud (that was released as part of the C60 A/C package on 350 cars, standard on all 4400 series cars (442). Also the chrome P05 SS1 wheels were not available on any Cutlass model at the time the 68 Ramrods were built (50 in Jan, 1968, and 450 more in March and April 1968). Only the plain steel 14 x 6 (442) wheels were available (standard equipment) and the new for 1968 Motor Wheel SSII released later under the N66 option code. Huge problem with people that ordered early 1968 Cutlasses with the chrome Magnum 500 style SS1 P05 wheels, but car was delievered with these new painted wheels. Olds screwed up here and substituted in the wheel change early in the 1968 model year in the same option designation (P05) without telling the dealers or anyone else. Not good. Many pissed off buyers that wanted the chrome wheel and didn't (and couldn't) get the one they wanted. I heard of dealers changing them to the SS1's when customers were irate and refused delivery of the car unless they did. Very few W31's (or 442's for that matter) came out with plain wheels and dog dishes. Ones that did were slated only for racing, or the owners went straigh to the tire stores and bought a set of chrome reverse, Cragar SS, or other aftermarket wheels. You wouldn't be seen dead with plain el strippo wheels. Ones that did ran without the hubcaps anyway. What's really unknown (or was for many years), was the fact that much of the unique engine parts for the 500 car special build of the 68's came in individual boxes from the suppliers, not in the normal high volume process and packaging. All engines were assembled in a special area of the Olds engine plant (where the parts were delivered) where the W30 and other low volume engines with unique parts were built. Those parts as listed in 442.com are the unique camshaft, pistons, carburetor, harmonic balancer (crank damper), and most significantly the complete cylinder heads. The heads were the trick on the W31's and what made them so different from the standard 310 hp 350's (even if you added the larger valves). It's highly possible that the 68's had some trick head castings fed into the system at the outside shop from the casting supplier. No one would ever admit that, as all manufacturers had their special parts for their race cars with the correct production identification numbers on them. The castings were not taken from the normal inventory already inside Oldsmobile. The castings went directly from the casting supplier to the outside shop that machined and assembled them. Everything was dead nuts on these heads and included cc checks of the combustion chambers. These heads took full advantage of the "sweet spot" in this package without any special porting. Other heads can perform as well and maybe even better with the larger valves and minor porting by someone who knows how to do it. But that was illegal then in Stock classses and still today in Pure Stock and Factory Stock racing. The valve springs and retainers were aftermarket and special also. All of the 1968 Ramrod engines were sent over to the engineering dynometer for special perfomance hp and torque checks. A copy of those dyno runs was kept on file in the engine plant and a few of us were lucky enough to get a copy of our own engines curves. They were looking for the 325 hp rating at 5600 and were not run over 6000. The hp curve was still climbing at that point. The 1969 and 1970 models were built on the normal assembly lines and delivered to the final assembly line on the regular engine delivery monorail conveyor. The 68's were delivered on engine dollies to the assembly line from the engineering dynos. When it arrived in finalk car assembly, this was the flag that a particular car was OK to be scheduled and started down the line. There's more, like the special unique clutch and pressure plates (actually a Scheiffer unit) that already had a GM part number assigned to it from Chevrolet on the L88 Corvettes. A lot of this special handling was also rumored to be on a lot more W cars back then, but the only ones that were dedicated as race cars and special batch built were the 54 1966 W30 cars and the 500 68 Ramrods. Sorry for the epistle, but I get on a roll in the middle of the night.
That W-31 info from the Olds FAQ at 442.com is rather old. And it is known there are many errors in it, including mine as I didn't know as much then as I know now. And trying to get that changed, which has been attempted for a few years, is futile. The sad thing is a lot of people are taking that as gospel even though attempts have been made to correct it in hopes of educating more. (or creating clones to pass off as real ones :laugh: )
Thanks for picking a good one, Frank. I loved the 56's....That's the year I started driving and also had my first drag race. Chris: Recall you helped with that, nothing intended there. Pretty good job for not getting the inside info on it. What upset me was not even responding to me when I offerred to help correct some of this and add to it.
