Brian, aka Martin Sr, has some excellent articles here: http://www.autobodystore.com/martinsr.shtml See the 'Painting Basics' link for spray gun setup.:TU:
btw ... is $140 for a gallon of dp90 epoxy primer average price....and about $40 for the Catalyst ???? :eek2: :eek2: thats at a nearby supply joint ....about same that i can see on internet... also ..would a whole gallon and whatever Catalyst would be enough to do the frame and the whole shell twice .....???? dp90 black primer on shell ...and then after that gray colored filler prime on shell ....it would be my somewhat automatic guide coat when block sanding ... I learn quick ...
Yeah, that's why I stopped using the PPG epoxy. :dollar: I despise the mixing ratios as well...it's a real PITA when you need to only mix a few ounces for a small job. PPG does have an off-brand avail at a lower cost. Ask about their OMNI brand. I've been using an epoxy primer from Viking paints. Our own JW from Trishield recommended it. It's an easy 1:1 mix, just add thinner to reduce to spray. http://www.vikingpaints.com/ I've also been using their black epoxy top coat for frame, susp, and under hood. Nice stuff, easy to use, and economical.:TU: BTW, there's alot of onfo on this board: www.hotrodders.com take a look
too late ... in the afternnon ....I found a place a bit farther from me and my cousin just picked it up gallon of ppg dp90 and the catalyst for $160 ....lowest I got from 4 places .. the only thing is that he gave me the ppg catalyst mix that you have to let sit for 30 minutes before spraying ....its a 2:1 mix 1 1/2 gallons for spray ..so I think its enough to do the frame and the whole shell inside out ....I hope.. yea... ..I think they got us cornered with the catalyst/reducers...
The 20-30 minute induction time gives you some time go back and double check everything anyway...this is the DP401 catalyst. I like it because it seems to add a slight amount of sheen to the black finish anyway. Seems like the mix and spray catalyst, DP402, dried to a flatter finish. This may have all changed via reformulation, etc. but that has been my experience. The 20-30 minutes also allows you to sit down and ask yourself....."What the hell have I got myself into?":Brow: Once you get the outer shell in DP90, typically this would be the time for any bodywork on the car. The metal is protected now so you can take your time and hammer, dolly, use whatever plastic filler, etc you have in mind. THEN---once the "bodywork" is done you would go back and seal all the areas, if any, that you used plastic with another coat or two of DP90 AND THEN PROCEED to the build primer stage. That way any plastic is well buried and sealed up under plenty of paint. I don't know what kind of damage, if any, the car has....does it have dings, dents, etc in it? Don't worry----your money was well spent...DP90 is good stuff.
ou: ...and thats the truth ....:grin: body work? ...just a quarter panel job x2 ...they could be patched up and slight bondo ...but I like to learn ou: going for longevity here ...you only do this once in life ...I hope ...doors,hoods,fenders are mint ... had the shell in the sandblast room ...cleans up the undercarriage real good ..very messy but great outcome ...
one question ....bcs I'm getting conflicting info with it what should be my last sandpaper grit on the bare metal shell before laying epoxy primer?? some say 80 others 180 and even 320 ..o No:
Frank, 80 grit will be fine. Gives the epoxy plenty of bite. Most likely you will be doing filler and skim coats over the first coat anyways. Then either more dp90 or a high build primer so any fine scratches will not show. Surprised Patton didn't chime in - must be out whoopin' it up somewhere.:beers2:
I'm here, I'm here:laugh: What Bill said on the 80 grit---Typically you would do the final sanding on the outer sheet metal with a 6" DA (compressor/air driven) sander with 80 grit stick on discs. Doesn't leave a rough finish like 36 or 40 grit would. You could also do the same thing with a 5" electric DA and sticky back sanding discs. You also have the option of hitting the bare metal with a PPG Metal Prep or Metal Conditioner I think prior to putting the epoxy on the outer shell. AGAIN----this info will be in the info sheets I mentioned that PPG makes available. If you choose to do this then buy a few rolls of paper towels, some rubber gloves and a few grey Scotchbrite pads. Follow the instructions on the bottle..it may call for dilution of the metal prep (with water of all things!!) and will also call for wiping off the wet panel with WATER SOAKED paper towels....again....seems odd on bare metal but it works. This is where an air compressor comes in handy...and you do have an air blower fitting DON'T YOU?:spank: If not go get one for dirt cheap at HDepot or HFreight...the kind that has the finger pullable trigger on it ( they are typically blue plastic with a metal blower nozzle coming out). These are lot easier to use than the old style pencil type and the better "trigger" gives you more control over the air pressure blowing out of the tip. Whether you metal prep it or not you will need to break out THE WAX AND GREASE REMOVER and lots of paper towels on the metal prior to putting the DP90 on there. WTH---try this: >Final sanding of panel to bare metal >Blow off panel with air gun (don't just stand back and blow at the overall panel...get the air blower a little closer and go over the whole panel...what you don't remove now (sanding dust, etc) will just have to be removed in the next step..which you shouldn't skip) >Wax and grease remover treatment on panel >Metal prep panel (or etch prime if PPG has an etch primer THEY recommend under the DP90) >Wax and grease AGAIN >Blow off >Prime with DP90 I'm not on here during the day much anymore as I was whooping it up on a couple Oldsmobile 442s we are scrambling to finish for the OCA Nats....which, BTW, are in BOWLING GREEN THIS YEAR for anyone looking to check some other cool cars out from July 17-July 22. The event is at one of the bigger hotels in Bowling Green (not at the track like the GSCA Nats)..but there is an Olds race scheduled for that Saturday at Beech Bend.
Just wanted to add that wiping a sandblasted surface with paper towels usually results in fuzz getting stuck on the surface.....so that's one of the reasons for DA sanding any blasted surface I can get to....it wipes off much easier. On some parts (like frame/susp), I'll do a final clean with scotchbrite and a steady blast of air. Patton, what brand of paper towels do you prefer for 'low lint'? PS I've had great results with Picklex metal conditioner. Blasted surfaces rust overnight here, so it's a great 'preserver' until I can get paint on it. Like any other prep or paint product, It's important to read and follow the instructions!!
thanks guys ....I will think about that metal prep... priming by end of week hopefully.... have problems with the sand blast media getting clogged every 30 seconds at nozzle ...must be all that crud stuff from rear wheel wells that I knocked off mixing in with my media....time from some fresh stuff... found out from spying in chevelle forum they sell the stuff at Menards ...$6 for 50lbs bag ...:bglasses: finished 1/2 the interior already ....looking good..:grin:
Walt--good tip on the towels and sandblasted surface...no matter what brand they will easily tear up and leave lots of lint. Like you, if I metal prep a sandblasted surface it's Scotchbrite pads...which will also tear up somewhat or snag on sharp spots and can leave some "lint". But--much less of a problem than paper towels create. If you want real low lint then you can always get a box of DuPont Sonterra wipe towels or something specifically made for wiping on car bodies during the paint process. It would probably be a good idea to invest in a box of these to at least use if and when you are going to be spraying the final color and/or clearcoat. Even then a final tack rag wiping should follow. I would only use plain white paper towels (any grocery store brand that at least says "lint free" and yep, they will still leave lint) on the DA'd surfaces like you mentioned..which would likely mean only the outer body panels. On an outer body I try to only do a panel or two at a time so I can move on to the epoxy priming stage ASAP. Get some fine screen to sift out the larger chunks of stuff...maybe that will help. Also--a lot of these blast units only like to run decent on wide open air pressure with just enough opening on the sand valve to start removing the paint. Too far open on the sand valve and the hose seems to sometimes build up with too much sand and start skipping. Naturally, you then run down the air from the compressor unless you have a monster air supply. It's always something when you don't have massive air supply (which I don't). Someday..hopefully when we still have some cars to restore...maybe the prices of these cool screw drive air compressors will come down to our price levels. Talk about NICE!!!----DRY, DRY AIR (built in refrigerators I think) and HUGE CFM---and to top it off QUIET when compared to regular piston driven units. compressors.
will be epoxy priming frame tonight (late night action ) any fast tips on gun set up ? or just experiment gun is a devilbis finish line 3 with 1.8 tip epoxy is the dp90 with the catalyst that you mix and wait aprox 30 minutes before shooting ...
That's a pretty large tip for this type of primer. That tip size is more typically used for urethane build primers which are thicker and need more build vs epoxies. Consequently, you will want to play with the gun so you aren't loading real thick coats on there. You stil want whatever air pressure they recommend as turning the air down will just result in the material not getting well disbursed and the coating might be real lumpy or orange peely. I would prefer a 1.5 or even something as small as a 1.3 tip for DP90. Remember to allow whatever flash time PPG recommends between coats. If there is a way to regulate the material feed in that gun then experiment with that. It's your frame so a little extra won't hurt you there---I would, however, find a way to control the material feed or get a smaller tip when ou start shooting body panels. You'll save some on materials also (or what materials you have will go further). The 20-30 minute induction time with the 401 catalyst will allow you to try to find the gun instructions and see what they recommend
smaller tip size.....ok ...I will go with 1.5 didn't get a chance to paint ....relatives came over and was bored...:boring: :grin: but maybe that was a sign for me to hold off or else I would of blasted with 1.8 tonight hopefully ..
I dp90'ed the frame ....came out very nice ...the 1.5 tip was the ticket ....seems its going to be a shame to put a body on top of the frame ...:grin: I only used about 1 1/2 qrts for two coats and 3 coats in a few spots the dp90 seems to go a long way and I like the way it spread
Man...that looks good! It does look like the paiint laid out real nice. Also---please describe the booth you made and where/what type fans you have in there. Looks like the intake filters on one end. What size wood did you use for the frame?
laid out real smooth ....kind of surprise how well it came out for a beginner like me ...good thing you guys are here... the paint room ..?? oh you mean "The Box" go here for my homemade sandblasting and then redone paint booth ...and finished frame pics.. http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?t=69762&page=8 frame after last coat of eastwoods chassis black extreme satin ...the lighting makes it shiny a bit more than what it is....very satisfies with the dp90 and eastwoods paint .... we no touch for 2 days and start on shell....what fun ..
