Buick 464 big-block

Is the buick 464 a race engine? Is it street legal? Can you run them on pump gas? What kind of torque and horses can you crank out? Im sorry to ask all these questions, but i just want to know how these "Smaller" buick big-blocks work. I've seen a few people listed with these engines, and i was hoping i could get soem knowledge on them. Thanks.

-Cody

 

I should've known that. lol:laugh: Thanks. They do build buick race engines, like the 505(?) and 535(?), which are very good, and are claimed to be "scary-fast", and it is very beliveable too.

-Cody

 

Which, I believe, are all 455 blocks bored and strokeduzzled:

 

Yup mine is a 464,455 .038 overbore,totally streetable.

Thanks

 

Thanks. I get mixed up sometimes:spank: Oh well, i guess you learn something new everyday. Although, i seen somewhere that the 535 engine produces 800 and something horsepower, and i don't know how much torque. I will try to look for it.

-Cody

 

Now i know, Jim weise has a 525 buick engine that pumps out 760 horses.........:eek2: But i know i seen 535 somewhere.

-Cody

 

I think thats what Mike Garrisons monster 800+hp 800+torque monster is.. alls i can say is that it took an @$$ load of $$ to do it though, i remember reading about a year or more ago that it took about 21k:eek2: :eek2:

 

:jd: money, there with-lies the problem.

-Cody

 

Board member buicksstage1 is working on a 540ci stage 4...

 

When they do that do they have to cut metal out of the block to make room for the extra stroke?

I know they have to do that on a Nailhead. It really butcher's the block. Then there's the octane problem. That's the reason I didn't do that to mine, I was tempted though.:Brow:

 

I really don't think octane is a concern. Race Gas only!

Traction, now there's a PROBLEM! :eek2: :Brow:

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

 

You're correct....I would want to run mine with stock tires.....stock looking motor........maybe stock exhaust.......a real sleeper:Brow:

Wouldn't be much good with no traction!:grin:

 

Cody,

That 525 ended up at 804 HP.. it was a 494 when it made 760.

As far as how the bigger motors are built, it goes like this..

A 455 is a 3.90 stroke, and a 4.312 bore
A 462 is a 3.90 stroke and a 4. 342 bore
A 464 is a 3.90 stroke and a 4.350 bore
A 494 is a 4.150 stroke / 4.350 bore engine.

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this is where it gets really expensive, as it requires a billet crankshaft. All the above motors can be built with a stock crank

A 525 is a 4.400 stroke / 4.360 bore engine

A 529 ( or 528) is a 4.342 (28) or 4.350(29) bore with a 4.500 stroke

A 532 is a 4.360 bore, with a 4.500 stroke

A 535 is a 4.375 bore, with a 4.500 stroke.

These are the general "norms".

There is a slightly stroked 470 CI .038 over motor too, but since I don't build that one, the numbers on that would require that I break into my CI program.. and it's too dang late for that..

And some clearancing of the block girdle may be required, depends on if you use alumium or steel rods, and what stroke you use. A lot of us like to stick with a 4.400 stroke, vs the 4.500, as we feel it is easier on the block. That is exactly why I built Sweesy's 525 that way.. I want it to live.

As far as a 464 goes, the main reason for building a street motor to that size is the availability of better pistons and rings for that bore size. I build both 462 (.030 over) and 464 (.038 over) motors here. The higher HP ones are typically 464's, not because the extra 2" makes a difference, but because of the upgraded parts for that bore size.

Hope that answers your questions.

JW

 

464

Jim, I am interested in building a 464. I have heard that 455 bored .038 accepts Mopar 440 pistons and rings. Do I need different rods too? What compression pistons should I use. I am planning on using TA stage 2 aluminum heads (63cc comb. chamber I think) and don't want to have valve clearance problems. I am looking for a final compression of around 10:1. I called Northern Autoparts today and was quoted for some speedpro pistons pn# H143CP (440 mopar) The salesman told me that they yeild 9.3 comp with 78 cc mopar heads, and 10.1 with 88 cc mopar heads. Any info would be much appreciated.
Thanks

 

Skyman..

Nope.. it's a Buick Piston that just happens to be that bore size. It is the mopar ring set, or more specifically just a 4.350 bore ring set. Well, if we want to get really picky, it's a 4.320 + .035 set..

A .030 over 440 mopar file fit ring. The extra .005 is there for file fitting of the compression ring end gaps.

But that is all that is 440 Mopar. Just the rings.


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TA has these pistons, SRP's made by JE.. also finishline has a set of 4.350 pistons too..

This can be done with stock rods and crank, no problem, Brent Holm's and Tim Hol's motors are 464's, Brent's is stock crank and rods, Tim's is the TA sportsman rod, and stock crank.

Brent's mill made 485 HP an 550 Torque, and Tim's is the motor in my avatar, 600's a pair..

Both of these motors could have been built with the Speed Pro's, (budget forged .030 pistons), and that is still the piston of choice for my Level 1 iron and 1A manifold motor. Good cost/benefit ratio... Brent's is a Level 1 with STG 1 ported heads, and his went .038 over, because his motor was already .030 over, and we got lucky to bolt the torque plate on it, and hone it to fit the slightly larger pistons.

Tim's is the new 2A motor, with all kinds of goodies, and if your gonna step up for that kinda power, then for my money the best pistons to have in there are the SRP's.

All the available .038 (4.350 bore) pistons use the more desirable 1/16-1/16-3/16 ring package, vs the stock Buick 5/64 compression rings. The smaller rings contribute to less ring flutter, and more HP, as well as being lighter. All desirable situations.

JW

 

So, you can offset grind a stock crank and get .250 more stroke out of it? Could you just as easily destroke it .250", run a longer lightweight rod and piston, and turn a lot of RPM with it? That would be cool.

 

Thanks Jim:beer It pretty much answered my question(s). I may be an interested buyer in the future for one of the street legal big blocks you have to offer. Very good selection with outstanding hp and torque!:3gears:

Thanks

-Cody

 

1 more thing i need to ask you jim.......does T/A have any kind of performance parts or kits for a buick 350? Thanks

-Cody

 

This is a nice explanation of the different builds.