I plan on putting an electric fuel pump back by the fuel tank with a manual switch. I haven't bought an aftermarket pump for years and am looking for suggestions. I want to use it mainly for starting the car after it has been sitting for a while. Maybe an occasional drag race boost.:Brow: Bob H.
Holley electric blue or red seems to be a popular choice for electric+manual. If youre going through the trouble of installing one, just go full electric with the aeromotive 1000. Seems to be a good all around pump.
Sounds to me like its not something absolutely vital to your car, so you could try any stock electric replacement as an add-on. they are cheap. I am actually using one from Summit for my nitrous kit since I dont go past a 100shot. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PFS-10700/ As for a higher quality unit, from what I have seen the Holley Blue is quite popular. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-12-812-1/ I know that summit has some "package" deals that include it, the relay, and a regulator for a reasonable price. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CMB-03-0067/ You can really get expensive as you look at better and better units. Then again, it is usually true you get what you pay for. I had to send my 1st pump back to summit because it leaked like a sieve. The second one has been just fine.
Thanks for the replies fellows. I think the Summit 10700 is what I'm looking for. The Holley pumps are a nice set up but more than I need. Bob H.
Didn't see this yesterday Bob. The aeromotive sure is a nice set up, but may be more than you need. We also run Holley Blue with regulator and has been trouble free. One thing to consider, is your pump location and how it gets the fuel. Most pumps only push fuel, and have to be mounted below fuel level, and best fed from a sump of some type. The Holley blue has been a great pump for "sucking" the fuel from a stock tank set up. Just make sure whatever you get has been known to do the job you need it to do.
Bob, I've run a Holley Red back near the fuel tank for years. It does the job very nicely. The Stage1 pump will pull through it for everyday normal driving. If you want to step on it though, you need to turn the electric on. The electric pump will be a restriction in the line at higher demand, but with the electric on, it will supply enough fuel for up to about 600 HP. I will be going to the billet CV pump that JW sells with my new engine. That and 1/2" pickup and pushlok hose. I'll eventually sell my Holley Red.
I've never had any success at any level trying to install a "pusher" pump on any the vehicles I've owned over the years. When they reached a level of performance that required continuous unrestricted fuel delivery, a fuel cell, sumped tank, electric pump behind the tank, and 8AN lines/fittings everyplace was required, no exceptions. Even with that said, I've tried EVERYTHING you could possibly come up with in between a stone stock mechanical pump and full race system. What doesn't work. Any sort of "high performance" mechanical pump in conjunction with a completely stock fuel system. Before you start throwing rocks at me, keep reading. Without increasing the size of the suction line, and improving the pick-up type and location in the tank, those pumps face the same limited supply capabilities of a stock pump. Basically, they just suck harder on the same tiny 14' or so worth of fuel line, which, in most cases is 3/8" steel, or 5/16" inside diameter, BEFORE you bend it! From what I've seen, most stock systems are limited to about 400hp, IF you don't uncover the pick up in the tank on hard runs. A quick and easy cure for fuel delivery issues for most folks running very mild set-ups is to install a "pusher" pump is being discussed here. Most electric pumps are not "pull-thru", so they need to be running at all times. The Holley Red and Comp 110 pumps are excellent, and low psi, not requiring a regulator. Even so, if they are used as "pusher" pumps, or "dead head" without a return, pump life can be shortened considerably. One also has to consider, that when using that much pump as a "pusher", the mechanical pump becomes an obstruction for it right to start with. The Holley Blue and Comp 140 pumps require a regulator. Some folks claim the mechanical pump will act like a regulator, but this did NOT work effectively every single time I've tried it, and once again, this basically "dead heads'" the deal, and put a LOT of load on the pump. Even installing a very good electric pump in front of the tank using stock lines and pick-up, the limitations of the stock feed line and pick-up type and location, can still comprimise vehicle performance. It is best to size ALL the lines according to the pump capability, if you want maximum fuel delivery from that particular part. I would also note here, that Holley (and all the clones and spin-offs of that design) are EXTREMELY loud, as they use a vane type pump. They are even louder if you "dead head" them. The Comp 110 and 140 pumps are very quiet, as are the new Holley 150 and 180gph gear type pumps. I would still highly advise using a return style regulator with any of them, if you want quiet operation and maximum pump life. I use the Comp 140 pumps, have one in a box for a spare. Sumped tank, 8AN lines to a OMC high flow fuel filter, 8AN to the pump (behind the tank), 8AN to the engine mounted regulator/return line, 8AN to the nose of the carburetor. I used the exact same system without the return (briefly), the first pump lasted about a month and could be quite noisey at times. It burnt up the brushes and was rebuilt, the replacement lasted till last summer, and was put in service in 2001. It is now the spare, only requiring a set of brushes and cleaning it up. Sorry to be so windy here, as this particular topic can produce scores of different recomendations using a wide variety of parts. As soon as you even mention on the Pontiac boards the limiting capabilities of a stock fuel system, there will be 2 or 3 folks claiming 10 second runs using them, and 30 others who can't get out of the 13's trying to do the same thing.ou: I can only tell you what we have done here, on dozens of muscle cars, from mild to wild. From what I've seen, a car that doesn't hook up well, if at all, doesn't typically have too many issues at any power level. When you start finding good traction, leaving hard, and pinned against the seat.....ALL of the fuel in the tank is pinned up against the bumper. When your car reaches that level of performance, it becomes difficult, if not near impossible, to run fast and dead solid reliable under all conditions.......with most of the modified stock fuel systems folks come up with.......Cliff
Cliff, What do you think about the Billet CV fuel pump Jim Weise sells, and 1/2" pick up, and line to the pump?
Nice looking part! What is the rated output capacity and recomended minimum supply line size?.....Cliff
Let me start by saying thank you for your reply. That said, if you read my original post you will see I mainly want to use the pump to prime or fill the carb after it has sat for a while. I'm 72 and have been playing with cars what seems like forever. I guess you could say I am a well seasoned gear head. It has been a long time since I purchased an electric pusher type fuel pump. I always install them near the fuel tank and they have always worked for me with one that failed after years of use. The reason for my question was to see whats out there and what to avoid and where to go to buy one.:beer Bob H.
Not sure Cliff, but Jim said, and I quote, "It will supply anything you care to put license plates on". I will run it with -8AN push Lok hose and the Robb MC 1/2" pick up.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001Q8DDYA/?ie=UTF8&me=ATVPDKIKX0DER 40 gph, 5-9 psi, no regulator needed
I'm sure it will with a modified pick-up and 8AN supply lines. Back in 2001, when I first started my serious effort to make my car really fast at the track, I went thru just about every fuel pump, and fuel system you could try to feed my engine. Every time I thought I had conquered the problems, I'd make a change to the engine or car to go quicker, and all the troubles would come right back. I had reached a point where I'd just tell Deb to smack me in the nose before the next run at the track. At least it would already be bleeding before the car nosed over at the top of first gear and my nose bounced off the steering wheel! My last upgrade was as serious as the effort to make the car fast, and I haven't had the first hint of a fuel delivery problem since. Best advice I can give with this topic, is to install a 10 second fuel system on an 11 second car, rather than the other way around.....Cliff
Cliff, I guess you weren't wearing a helmet:grin: That's a violent nose over! I know the pump is made by CV, but I'm not sure which one Jim uses. I know he modifies one of these pumps to work with the BBB. I think he puts a Buick arm on them, and maybe does something else to them. I E mailed him and ask him to weigh in on this thread. http://www.cvproducts.com/Products/Fuel/Mechanical Fuel Pumps/ Bob, I think the Holley Red is ideal, and the Airtex one Scott linked should be fine also. You will have to have them on if you are leaning on the engine, otherwise, it will nose over.
Cliff/Larry The pump I use these days is made for a SBC, by CV products. Output, with -10 input lines and -8 output lines is 90 gallons per Minute (not hour) at 7000 rpm. These pumps use o-ring fittings, rather than pipe fittings, or inverted flare fittings, so volume is not compromised at the fitting, which is the typical bottleneck in mechanical pumps. Obviously we have no need for that much fuel, so I have had great sucess with this pump, in 600 HP street cars, with a -8 input line, feeding from a fuel cell, or modified (enlarged) pickup in a stock tank. A -6 ouput line to the carb is plenty big. I have 3800lbs cars in the mid 10's with this combo. I have also had sucess in 500 HP combos, with this pump, using the stock lines and pickup. I have run 4100lb cars in the 11's with this setup. ON the dyno, at 6300 rpm, at 600 HP no more than 1 psi loss from base pressure was observed on numerous occassions. Granted, I don't have 14 feet of bent up fuel line on the dyno, but the saftey margin is certainly there. On the roller cam motors, this pump fits perfectly, and strokes the pump nearly 100%, with just a change to the Buick arm. Stock flat tappet cams, with the smaller lobe, require a fair amount of porting to the housing, to allow adaquate pump stroke. JW
