455 Powered, I kinda know where you are coming from. I have twins that are seniors this year, both want to go to college. My son is working on a football scholarship, fingers crossed, and my daughter wants to be a physical therapist. She is working at an internship right now, and talking to the them about the job and the cost. Reality is hitter her in the face, 6 + years of school, 100k + in loans and a limited job market. They are 18, so the choice is theirs, they own it and all the bills that come along with it. I will help with what money I can, but I wont be tied to the loans !! I am glad i'm not 18 again ! The bad part is around here the high schools all push college like it is the only choice, it's a shame really.
Take her out to the Garage and tell her..." See Honey, BB Buicks don't just grow on trees"...……..That should do it...…..Higher education is over-rated.
There are probably a LOT of unclaimed scholarships. Many assume scholarships pay tuition, books, room/board... or all. Some do, but there are soooo many for other amounts that add up and go unclaimed. If unwilling or unable to research and apply for that little step, then why go more than "half way"? Not all scholarships are for sports or music. Example: https://www.scholarships.com/financ.../scholarships-by-state/illinois-scholarships/
Higher education is NOT overrated. Yes you can do well with just a GED, but more and more now you need a college degree. It improves the odds of success. Kinda like Jim Abbott pitching in MLB with only one hand, or that dude on the Seahawks in the NFL now who only has one hand -- sure it can be done, but the odds are working against you. I want my kids / daughters to go to the best school possible -- everyone here should too. Better school = better opportunities. That being said, yeah, financing it is a hell of a burden. Has she never heard of a student loan or financial aid? She needs to exhaust all avenues before forcing this on you.
Gotta say it's a good feeling this year. First time in 24 years no one in the family going back to school. First time since 2007 no one going back to university. Between our 3 children we put in 23 years of university tuition. 2 went 9 years, 1 was in for 5. No wonder I feel broke at times. Bank of Dad (as much as I could & more than I should have),student loans, some grants/bursaries & student Summer jobs helped along the way. Eldest has another 5 years residency in front of him, 1 year already down. He's in debt super-deep (real word ?) but will recover 1st position he gets. Second is a home-body & pounding the tar out of his debt. Third is just starting with minimal debt but she missed Class 101 of "spend less than you make" ! She'll recover. Looking back, wouldn't change anything. All 3 are working in their own fields & doing well. Each has kind of/sort of promised to take care of the old man when time comes I need help with my diapers. We'll see.
What we need is skilled laborers and tradesmen...not more college educated know it all's that have been fed a bunch of nonsense from their professors
A degree might improve the odds of success, but taking on student loan debt that gets a degree in German polka history or left handed puppetry is an exercise in foolishness. And getting a degree from a jc or state school gets the same paper that the fancy private college hands out without the giant loan debt if you aren't paying cash. Best is subject to interpretation. As above our oldest went to a state school and is getting the same offers and being chased down by districts that need bright young science and math teachers. Taking on twice or more the debt she has is silly just because a private school is somehow thought to be "better". Opportunity is only apparent to those ready and willing to take advantage of it, the rest just miss out and can't understand why they aren't making progress.
What we need are more educated people with college degrees to help us compete in the international marketplace. Higher education helps turn low wage unskilled labor into more desirable skilled labor.
Spend some time around kids and pay attention to their talents. Some are naturally gifted towards higher education careers... others gifts are in trades. My son is a second year sprinklerfitter (fire protection). He was paid to go to his first year schooling, had scholarships, was reimbursed all his education costs. He is hard working, physically fit and will be earning at minimum 100k per year when he’s 22, and that’s if he doesn’t work out of town or extra hours. He will not have any student loans. I would say that is a better start than most have coming out of university saddled with debt. I strongly believe people should live, work and play where they can be successfull. He struggled in high school and felt a failure. All that going to post secondary would do is reinforce that feeling. He had a junior high gym teacher tell him he would be a failure because he showed initiative and didn’t stupidly follow her directions and stop and wait to be told what next to do, like a government employee drone would. He already earns more than she does. I feel sorry for the kids that are pushed into universities by parents that think that is the only way to be successful. Too many people turn their nose up at dirty trades
Better colleges = better education. I went to THE best school in my field. Not only did that open doors for me, but over time I have been repeatedly shocked by the gaping holes in knowledge of grads from other schools, whereas grads from my college have proven universally sharp. And I am truly not being biased -- it is simply a fact. That is not to say that grads from second tier colleges won't out perform others -- plenty of sharp people there too. And plenty of room for success. But the best schools simply give you a leg up on the competition at the outset. Easy to say all colleges are equal. But when you need a heart specialist you probably won't pick the guy with the degree from East Carribean University, nor will you pick the lawyer from Southern Westside County Law College to sue that idiot doctor for malpractice. Even in trades, a business degree can be a valuable tool as your career moves forward. Quality education is our best hope for the future, and higher education is the key.
One size does not fit all. 50% of the time higher education works out, other 50% it doesn't. My point is that it has been pushed on HS kids for generations that it is the only answer to success....I say that it is VERY OVERATED. Examples exist on both ends of that spectrum. Examples: Pipe-fitter $100K, no debt.....US contractor overseas $200K (me for 10+ years+), small business owner $250K + easily all with NO HIGHER EDUCATION.......................School Teacher $35k, Public defender Attorney $60K, and most of the guys I went to HS with and graduated College with Business degrees got out in 1988 working at collection agencys make $25k, with $40k education. Today's environment only rewards kids who achieve a MASTERS Degree. A BS is just that, BS these days.
I have seen plenty of engineers that are very "Book Smart" but have no mechanical aptitude. Some of them came from big name schools. They were not very helpful with hands on projects. We have a tech with a two year degree that knows the product inside and out and is the most valuable member of most teams he is put on due to his hands on understanding on how the product works. Getting a degree does not automatically make you valuable in that field no matter where it came from.
You aren't seeing the big picture. Your example is a tree in the forest. It might be the biggest tree but that one tree isn't the whole forest and can't support it. Plenty of graduates can't, won't or don't even head into the real world. They got there because dad pulled the strings and got them the paper. They get on with the family business or they don't even have to work. The other side of this is the individual who goes scratching and saving to get through the jc or state school. Puts in the time really studying and doing the work. They might not have the prestige but they do have the education. I went to the "big name" for a semester. Cost me upwards of $5k thirty yrs ago. As an eighteen yr old I couldn't see the upside of going seven or nine more semesters at this money. Looking back it might have been the wrong decision and would have had a drastically different outcome if I might have graduated. But for me it was the right decision to get a job and not go into debt to get that paper. Competing against the world with education while saddling our next generation with soul crushing debt to get there? Not even close. Our education system is broken. But that delves into the political so i'll leave that alone. Throwing money at a problem isn't a solution.
Lets take a breath here folks - degree, no degree, trades, white collar: it does not matter as long as you are trying to do your best to be the best you. Get the kids out of the nest with the tools they need to succeed in their chosen life...and it might change 3 times in their life. See what they want to do and help them get there!
Higher education offers many of the same benefits and drawbacks as good parenting. Good parenting: -- Is more expensive than bad parenting. -- does not guarantee any sort of success for your kids. Bad parenting: -- is cheap and easy. -- Can still result in your kids being amazing successes. Still, we all tend to play the odds and try to be good parents, because it simply increases the odds of your kids turning out well. No guarantees, but worth the expense and effort. Higher education -- may the odds always be in your favor!
I disagree that Good parenting is more expensive than bad parenting. A good parent is a good parent and you do the best and teach your kids no matter what you can "give" them in money or possessions. Spoiling is expensive. The real answer is that if you cannot afford to have kids you should not, having kids is a privilege (you earn by supporting yourself first), not a right. If either of my sons had an interest or skill in the trades business I would not be afraid to let them forgo higher education. There is always going to be a need for electricians, plumbers, equipment operators, air conditioner repairs, etc...The less people there are around to do that, the more expensive they are going to be.
I don't have kids myself, but I've got quite a few friends with kids that are high school age, and also a lot of 16-20 year-olds come and work for us in the wash bay or as shop porters throughout the year. My suggestion has always been: If you aren't sure what you want to do, don't just go to college because "you're supposed to", you'll no doubt just end up wasting years of your life and owe thousands of dollars for it, and have what to show for it? Some memories of being in college? If you think you might have a career you want to try, see if you can get in at the ground floor at a place that does what you're interested in. Get on an apprenticeship program if it turns out it suits you. Get paid to learn, instead of paying to learn. Plus, you'll already have a job lined up when your training is done....Two of my best guys came out of the wash bay. They worked hard, we could see they were bright and hard working kids (difficult to find now), so we offered to have them work alongside the shop foreman for a few months, then send them to GM training. In return they had to sign a contract to work as techs in our shop for 3 years. They're both in the shop doing great now. I got two good techs out of the deal, they both got CAREERS out of the deal, and my good guys make over 100K/year, which is cutting a pretty fat hog in this area. They owe the world exactly $0 for their education.
I think a lot of what the hands on guys see is aptitude vs. Educated. You can't teach aptitude really and some ppl no matter how well educated are simply not adept in their field. I hired a "draftsman" with extensive training and proficiency with the software. Unfortunately he was not capable of doing a simple 3 view drawing from a structural print. He lacked the ability to process abstract spatial ideas. He would however make an excellent Autocad instructor at University.
