Hey Guys, I need some schooling, What is the difference between manual and power brakes. I used to have a 68 Riv, i'm assuming it had power brakes because of the booster correct? Well I picked up a 69 Skylark Custom and the brake is scary! I its firm and soft but it brakes, almost near the lowest point pressed in, it takes longer to stop than the Riv I used tohave. I noticed that it had no Brake booster, Is that why it feel like it stops later? Or do i just need to bleed the system. I just want to be safe here, What would I need to convert to power brakes? Maybe even Disc brakes, Nothing too expensive.
Usually,,, the only difference between straight brakes and power brakes is that there is a booster sandwiched in between the master cyl and the firewall... to convert to p/b the dealers had a kit that contained all the neccessary stuff...or take the cheap way and go to a bone yard ,like I did...:laugh: :laugh: I would say that you most likely need to do a brake job... what you are describing is what happens when the shoes get worn out and the adjusters reach their limit....first put a eyeball on the brake shoes to determine exactly what they need .... it is not normal for brakes to be mushy,,, the pedal should be solid and high, unless it is a power brake system then it should be firm and catch up solid, no lower than 1 inch from the floor... if not , find out why,,, no brakes can get you hurt....
I was thinking the same thing. You might try just adjusting out the shoes if they are in good shape after you inspect them.
I'm no wrenching expert, but these guys are right. Check it all out. Use the KISS principle. One extra note though; I had replaced everything except the master cylinder, the booster, and the lines on my '66 'Lark and my brakes went out. Bled 'em multiple times. They'd be fine for a day or two and start going out again. There were no leaks in the lines. Turns out 44 years isn't very good for the rubber diaphragm in the booster. I upgraded to a corvette type dual M.C. and booster. Works great! AND when I up-grade to discs all around I'll only need to add a proportioning valve. (and the brakes of course.)
I thought I had fixed it but it happened just as you mentioned, Now my setup is manual brakes and I have not noticed anything leaking, So I can Rule out the master cylinder, Any other possible culprit in the system, When I bleed them, They feel great, then after they return to the same scary pedal to the floor stateuzzled:
Sit in the drivers seat and put gentle pressure on the brake pedal and hold it.... if the pedal slowly goes down to the floor the master cyl. is leaking down.... if it holds firm and steady, it is ok.....
You should really go through and inspect the whole system, including each individual wheel cylinder. Depending on what the previous owner did for it, weak points with an aging car tend to be the master as someone else said, and wheel cylinders, notorious for leaking. You can pull the wheel and drum (get the drums spec'd out by the way) and peel back the black rubber boot on each WC and have a peak - see anything wet in there? That would be brake fluid leaking past the piston. Replace it. Heck, if it's obviously been a while, or you're not sure - replace them all, the master, and the shoes (pay a few extra bucks and get the riveted ones by the way) and be done with it.
I hate to say it, but your best bet would be to take the car to a shop and have a professional technician evaluate your brakes. You have a responsibility to put a safe car on the road, and unless you have adequate knowledge or somebody to help you understand the system you should not risk working on the brakes yourself. Whatever you decide, don't take shortcuts. Insist on good parts, don't use junkyard stuff for pads, lines, hoses, etc. New parts are not that expensive. Master cylinders are different between power and non-power systems. Disc brakes need proportioning valves to keep from locking up the front brakes and causing a loss of control.
I understand, from what i know the front brakes were replaced and the rear was left because they looked okay. I will most likely check the rear wheel cylinders because after only bleeding the rear, it worked, will just replace them,, they are only 9 $
Taking it to a good shop will square it away, but you will likely get killed on the labor cost:dollar: :dollar: , not to mention mark-up on the parts. Why not give it a go yourself? Get the shop manual or a good Chilton's covering the year. Some brake tools / a bleeder borrowed from the local parts shop, the parts, a buddy to help and give it a shot. That's what I did and it turned out fine. Even when it didn't (bleeding is not my forte') I took it in to the shop and they bled it, adjusted it for far less than the whole job would have been.
Im pretty knowlegable and mechanically inclined even if im young, i try to do most of the work myselr becquse college is expensive and shops around here are too. I have the 68 service manual i had when i had the 68 rivi, that one had powerbrakes, i had replaced the master cylinder and watched the mechanic rebuilt the wheel cylinders. I will most likely remove the rear drums, have them turned get new shoes and cylinders and bleed the system. Maybe later ill covert to front discs, i just dont know if a kit is a direct bolt on, or hoe difficult ot is, well the most important thing is that the car stops safely
Ok, but did you replace the BOOSTER? That was the culprit in my case, and I'd almost lay :dollar: that it'll turn out to be the same in your case. BUT:Smarty: like the other guys have said; you, I, we all, have a responsibility to put a safe car on the road. Check each wheel w/the drum off, are the slave cylinders leaking? Check EVERY line with somebody pumping the brakes. Did you bench bleed the M.C. before installation? If all this is done and there is nothing to show for it; new booster time.
The car is equipped with manual brakes, No booster, I have not removed the master cylinder, I am going to check the rear cylinders too, this week, it appears that they are the ones that might be letting air into the system because after bleeding just the rear, The car braked very well. And I do understand that it is everyones responsibility to have a safe running car, not only for our own safety but for other drivers on the road, even if half of them drive like they are in NASCAR, Especially those 4 bangers
Once the system is properly bled, the air should not be a further issue....The only way for air to get in, is if the system is broken open again...the m/c resevore holds the fluid up over the m/c plunger assy..... the air bubbles, in the fluid that is installed , goes up and eliminate themselves....if, if , the res. is full when the pedal is pumped.... then fluid only is forced in, not air... and any air that is further down in the lines goes into the cyls untill it gets full and the air again floats to the top and is bled out the bleeder screws...now.... if air is a continueing problem look for a hole in the system somewhere....loose fitting, rust hole in a line, [that would be leaking] busted wheel cyl, [that would be leaking] Some systems are harder to bleed [Gerling, for instance] than American Bendix type... Once properly adjusted up, [must be done first] and then bled, the pedal should be rock solid.... if you can put your foot on the pedal, with pressure, and the pedal slowly goes down to the floor , then the m/c plunger is leaking .....and needs to be rebuilt/replaced...
