For me, this is a HOBBY. The enjoyment comes from chasing parts, refurbishing old stuff to new looking, and driving my car on nice days. Once the speculators, investors, and super rich folks get involved, the hobby is now considered an investment, and greed takes over. There are a lot of folks who restoe their cars by sending it to a resto shop, sending in a check every month, and pick it up "done". I did not get into this hobby to calculate a ROI. It is just relaxation. If the parts prices continue to get out of hand, I will switch hobbies.
Then again, there are some people that used to treat this as a hobby, but now have to rely upon it as a source of funds to keep in it. That means selling off some of the stuff that you may have had for the last 20 or 30 years. It isn't easy to part with some of this stuff, just like anything collectable. If someone will pay the big bucks for it, why would anyone not take advantage of the free market? It's a zero sum game at this point, myself included after 50 years doing this. It seems that people think differently about the value and cost of these parts and cars depending upon whether they're buying or selling. That's not new, nor is it unique to this hobby/business/ passion/livelihood.
I don't think the auction's "north of 15k" comment was meant as arrogance. I think the seller was simply saying he's not interested in ending the auction early. I wish more sellers were like that. Let the market decide! Obviously he was expecting bids north of 7k. That's reasonable seeing as how the last eBay set of H heads sold for over 6k and were cores, not ready to install and assembled by a reliable Olds builder. If anyone doesn't like high prices for rare parts and cars, they are free to build plain Cutlasses or W-car clones. Am I furious that some multi-millionaire is willing to pay millions for the Mona Lisa? No. I'll be content with a reproduction hanging on my wall. Life isn't fair; we can't all own rarity.
Last year my 16 y/o stumbled upon a car collector who was moving out of state. He sold a garage full of 57 Bel Air parts (enough for 4 cars) to my boy for $800. My boy said the collection also included enough '55 parts (for his car) to offset what I thought was an unnecessary purchase. Since he didn't need the '57 parts he sold them at a "part-a-rama". He sold them for well below market because he only wanted to make enough $$ to keep his project going. How do we know he sold them for below market? We found them for sale elsewhere at the show. He didn't care though. He spent three days swapping, selling and talking cars with (some of 'em) fellow enthusiasts. Example: He sold 9 '69 Chevelle radio antennaes for $1 each. We found them for $20 later.ou:
That could be. Tone is VERY hard to convey in type. Though some hard core eBayers are just that hardcore. Can you imagine going sto Wal-Mart and being told don't bother unless you're paying this way or have a credit score of this? Some don't know how to treat their "customers". But I'm done with this now. Like I said, it could just be how I interpeted it.
My friend who is a long time Olds racer had two sets of those a couple of years ago. He ebayed them got about 3 or 4K for them. Looks like they have gone up even more since then. Thye are probably his old ones. I think he still has NOS single "F" 70 head.
its hard to guage the mark on something like this when the seller puts in a crazy reserve price . i looked at the bidding and it just turned into a fishing expedition by a couple of the bidders . want to figure out the REAL market , put it at no reserve , start it at a buck and keep your filthy shills out of the mix .
I got to thinking about this and how does that (or any) piece of an Olds warrant that kind of a price? I mean I might understand $15K for heads to a $150K Hemi Cuda convertible based on the overall "value" of the car. But I don't think(?) there's an Olds out there fetching prices on a regular basis to justify that kind of a price. Or am I mistaken.
There are some that would, and have, caught those kinds of bids. For example, the low mileage original Matador Red/Black stripe 70 W30 we had at the Nats this year. The owner and a buddy of his threw it up on Ebay prior to the Nats to generate some noise about the car. It bid to $160+k prior to the auction being ended early. This is an unrestored original 4 speed convert. I suppose a 71 or 2 would so something similar. People have paid some fairly crazy prices for some of these Olds's already from what I hear. I'm not trying to boost the market nor do I have some hidden agenda...just posting info. Remember---we are talking about cars/models/options that only a handful of exist.
My 71 W-30 Triple Black 4 speed conv brought 176.500 at Mecum in Belverdere and 70 W-30 auto brought 175.000 at Mecum in Jan. 06
Here's the deal. Re-read the auction and you'll understand the $15k comment. I wrote the comment very clearly, just read it, maybe you need to read slower or something. The comment is very clear in it's intention. I said the auction would be running to the end. To head off every dillweed on the planet emailing me to ask "what will it take to end the auction", I said $15k would happily end it. Obviously I did not expect to get double what they were worth, but if someone absolutely had to jump to the head of the line and needed to have the auction end unfairly for everyone else, then they were going to need to pony up double the reserve. Otherwise, just like I said, bid on the item just like everyone else, which is the fair thing to do, and you can buy them for less than the $15k. That being said, to those who have commented about me asking too much, what would you ask for a pair of these heads if you owned them? Go ahead, answer..... But know this... The last set on ebay did $6000 as undone cores and a set just sold on Oct 3rd at the Carlisle Swap Meet for $6200, again, undone. Knowing that, would you ask $500 for yours? Using that knowledge, my reserve was $7500. Might have been fishing a little, but they are done, guaranteed, clean, nice and no surprises later. For those who are wondering, yes they are sold. Not for $7500, but for something near that. That's the market, that's what it costs to buy H heads. :moonu:
Congrats on the sale. :TU: I think everyone will keep their eyes a little more open for the H heads from now on.
Well said Jeff and congrats on getting that price. To John A. I am always watching to see where "real" W-30 car sell. I noticed the latest Mecum auction and note that the car has to be documented, It has to have an original paint color, it also has to have a desireable pedigree to fetch the big bucks. I have been keeping an extensive data base on 71 W-30 cars for 20 years and can safley attest to the real and fake ones.
Didn't realize the market had gotten that crazy for Olds. Maybe I'll sell mine. Piece by piece of course. That way I can max out my investment AND since my car will no longer exist it will make everyone elses worth more. p Then they can sell their car in pieces thus reducing the number of surviving cars who can then sell.........yay eBay!
I was interested in hearing more information about a triple black 1971 W-30 four-speed convertible that sold at the 2007 spring Belvidere, Illinois Mecum auction. This auto was clearly not one of the thirty-two legitimate 1971 Olds 442 W-30 convertible four-speed factory built cars. But instead just a 442 convertible that was converted into a well-assembled W-30 clone. This car had NO documentation to prove any sort of authenticity or history. This particular 1971 W-30 convertible four-speed of which I speak was triple black with white stripes and was sold by a Muscle Car broker. This car had the wrong cylinder heads, air conditioning & power brakes and was also missing the correct 1971 W-30 four-speed cam. I tried to question the auto broker but he was very hostile & evasive about the car’s history etc. True and authentic W-30 four-speed cars should not have air conditioning or power brakes as far as I am aware. This car also sported a rear spoiler which is not correct for any factory correct Olds 442 convertible. The car sold with commission for around 175K. But this was clearly not a legitimate 1971 W-30 four-speed convertible but instead just a nicely done clone. But, I assume this buyer was sold more on the cars visual appeal rather than its authenticity. With that being said about this particular car-it is very true that authentic and concours restored 1970-1972 W-30 four-speed convertible’s w/ bulletproof documentation & histories have been selling between private Oldsmobile collectors for astronomical sums. But these sales have largely gone unreported because they are moving between one private collector to another and are not in the public arena. The sad fact for the Oldsmobile community is the lack of any sort of historical services to document these cars. This has led to this incredible influx of very accurate clones being represented & sold as authentic W-cars. This has become a major problem for the Oldsmobile collectors-one, which appears, will only grow much worse in the future especially with the new crop of reproduction parts available including Oldsmobile D, F and H cylinder heads now being offered by “The Part Place.”
