Proform roller rockers

Discussion in 'Street/strip 400/430/455' started by matt68gs400, Jul 7, 2019.

  1. matt68gs400

    matt68gs400 Well-Known Member

    Still brainstorming here. But by the time a guy buys new springs, replaces the aluminum stock rockers, shaft, and retainers, etc, I’m going to have at least $250 into that. Thoughts on these proform 1.65 ratio rockers, or another roller rocker? Does a person really NEED $1,000 Harland sharp rockers for a 500 hp street machine?

    https://www.summitracing.com/parts/pro-66864/make/buick
     
    Nailhead Ronnie likes this.
  2. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    The proforms aren't even bronze bushed,...I had a set,..wasn't overly impressed not even in the same universe as TA
     
    matt68gs400 likes this.
  3. cruzn57

    cruzn57 cruzn57

    crane, isky, TA etc. NONE are bronze bushed, just heat treated extruded aluminum.
     
  4. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    Nah not true,..TA rockers utilize Torrington Bearings on the shaft,..Harlands are Needle Bearings and they may have went to Torrington also not sure. TD rockers are needle bearings

    Hard anodized they are but that alone riding on a steel shaft is ignorant. And that's why among other things they are inferior in every way to the TA

    The Kenne Bells and the Early TD rockers were bushed

    Matter of fact,..in the LS world,..the old school trunion bearing upgrage has given way to a bronze bushed trunion,..

    Cranes bottom of barrel Energizer rockers use a needle bearing fulcrum,..
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2019
  5. Jim Weise

    Jim Weise 1000+HP

    I have a set a customer sent me for evaluation.. the biggest issue with those rockers is that the pushrod seat is located in a position on that rocker, that you cannot get anything that even resembles good valvetrain geometry with them.

    I have had them sitting on the shelf for a couple years, just built an all iron 400 with a mild roller cam... just for grins, I test fitted those rockers, and they were unusable on that application. I did not spend a great amount of time with them, analyzing them against other rockers, just dropped them on, and broke out my checking pushrod.. and found that without massive modifications to the pushrod holes in the head, there was no pushrod length on that engine that would even approach a decent geometry.. I was also amused to see that they did not thread the adjuster holes all the way thru the body of the rocker, they have very limited adjustment range.

    I should have taken pictures, but was too busy laughing and throwing them back in the box.

    Swing and a miss with this product, and this issue is much worst than the lack of any bearing/bushing between the shaft and the rocker.

    JW
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2019
  6. Ken Warner

    Ken Warner Stand-up Philosopher


    What differentiates a torrington bearing from a needle or roller bearing in your mind?

    Having worked numerous times with the folks at Timken over the years I see these terms used a lot on car forums but I'm pretty sure they are all terms for the same type of bearing....
     
  7. 1973gs

    1973gs Well-Known Member

    I think a needle bearing goes around a shaft like in the roller rockers. A torrington bearing lays flat between two components like in a transmission. Not sure if that's correct, but that's what I think.
     
  8. 300sbb_overkill

    300sbb_overkill WWG1WGA. MAGA

    Not quite;

    A Torrington bearing handles side loading, it would replace a bronze washer that is there to protect a housing surface from the shoulder of a shaft.

    Needle bearings are what are in a cap of a U-joint, enough needles to fit on the inside of one diameter that fits on another one using grease to keep wear down.

    Roller bearings are either made to spin in a cage or have a hole through them that are held on by a smaller shaft in some sort of holder that can be pressed into a hole that will ride on a shaft for less wear.

    This is from my CRS memory so may not be an exact dictionary definition but should be close enough if I am recalling them correctly.
     
    Nailhead Ronnie likes this.
  9. Quick Buick

    Quick Buick Arlington Wa

    torrington bearing. = a bearing manufacturer that is a division of timken
     
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  10. 300sbb_overkill

    300sbb_overkill WWG1WGA. MAGA

    Yep;

    Torrington Bearings. Torrington produces a wide assortment of radial and thrust needle roller bearings as well as bearings assemblies for particular applications. Torrington bearings are manufacturing in facilities located in the United States, Canada, Germany, Brazil and Australia, France, China, India and Japan.

    I always heard the thrust style referred to as Torrington, stupid CRS anyway.


    What are roller bearings?
    Roller bearings are a type of bearing that use rolling elements to support loads and reduce friction. As opposed to ball bearings, roller bearings have barrel-shaped rolling elements instead of spherical balls. They are capable of supporting heavier loads than similarly sized ball bearings but cannot handle as high of speeds as ball bearings.


    What is a needle bearing?
    A needle bearing is a type of bearing that features roller elements which are longer and thinner than traditional roller bearing elements. Due to its considerably smaller roller diameters, the needle bearing is ideally suited for applications where reduced overall bearing heights are required.
     
  11. Quick Buick

    Quick Buick Arlington Wa

    FWIW if a gentleman with a English accent asked you for a mole wrench just had him a set locking pliers.. AKA vise-grips
     
  12. cruzn57

    cruzn57 cruzn57

     
  13. hugger

    hugger Well-Known Member

    Nah go ahead chief educate me
     
  14. TexasT

    TexasT Texas, where are you from

    I'd like some education, too. Please type it up again and post.

    We all have opinions. And some of us are probably right some of the time.

    I like the OP asking. If he knew he wouldn't have taken the time.
     
  15. matt68gs400

    matt68gs400 Well-Known Member

    About 30% of the time, I’m 50% right....
     
    Nailhead Ronnie likes this.
  16. cruzn57

    cruzn57 cruzn57

    I'm seldom right, ( just ask my wife)

    no manufacture currently offers roller rockers with bushings, ( they wouldn't be ROLLER rockers)
    most make an extruded aluminum rocker arm with roller bearing assy pressed into the rocker arm,
    and a roller bearing assy on a shaft for the valve end,
    there is a trend currently for bushed roller LIFTERS, ( again, then they are NOT roller bearing lifters)
    the bushed type need to oil fed, and depending on the type of bushing, usually do well, but do not last as long as
    bearing type do,
    I've installed every brand of roller rockers available in the last 25yrs, (forged, extruded, billet, etc)
    all work good depending on the application , and I've experienced more engine failures ( from testing parts)
    than most of you . so, based upon my experience , I feel I do know the difference between a bushing and a roller bearing.

    am I an expert? not hardly, but when someone says roller rocker uses bushings, well?
     
  17. BennyK81

    BennyK81 Well-Known Member

    What about the stock HD replacement? Is that no optionto go with?


    Product ID: TA_1317HD
    Heavy Duty Stock Rocker Assemblies, `70-`76 455

    Details

    Brand New, Heavy Duty Stamped Steel Rocker Arm Assemblies for `70-`76 455 Buick engines.

    USD 206.00
     
  18. LARRY70GS

    LARRY70GS a.k.a. "THE WIZARD"

    Of course, but once you go past a certain valve lift, stock rockers are not reliable, and you need roller rockers.
     
  19. matt68gs400

    matt68gs400 Well-Known Member

    For the 500 hp or less that I want, rollers are a waste of my money.
     
  20. LARRY70GS

    LARRY70GS a.k.a. "THE WIZARD"

    It isn't the power, it's valve lift and spring pressures that reach the durability limits of stock rockers.
     
    Marv Marksberry and 1972Mach1 like this.

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