The Big T/A Alumn Head Sale Sure Has Me Thinking

We looked really long and hard at the T&D setup, and here were the issues..

Requires different head studs, and there were not spacers supplied in the kit for the outside head bolt holes. We also would have needed spacers for the center 3 bolt holes, unless we milled that far into the casting, and we never made it that far to find out. The TA head has recesses for the spacers, and we would either have had to mill into the casting to get to that height, or take up the space with a spacer. Nothing was supplied with the kit, and I use the term "kit" loosely, as the directions were none existant.. only thing they say is how to determine the height. Nothing at all specific about this head.

Pushrod holes would have to have a alum rod installed in them, and then welded up, and the holes re-located for the longer SBC rocker. At least that is the only way I would feel comfortable doing it. Not a ton of room around the ports to just do a bigger hole, as his are max ported. Could slot them on a Bridgeport, but a bit tacky for my tastes.

We couild have done it, but considering the costs for doing it, and the cost of the rockers, I suggested we go a different way. We did a neat job of clearancing the TA rockers, and there are quite a few guys running this setup, so we hope for the best, until Mike comes out with a better, easier deal to install, which is in the works.

I really did like the look of the T&D setup, but quite a CF to install. And I really feel that kit is missing pieces.. spacers for the outside head bolts, most notably.. did T&D supply those for you, or did they just wack off the ends of the support plate? What did you do with head studs?.. that plate is 1/4 inch thick, and there is not that much room with TA studs. And having to get longer studs was another issue for these guys, wanting to get this deal together quickly.

WE also had a time issue, as it took a good while to get the development porting work done on that heads exhausts.

But of everything, the rockers worry me the most, but we considered this the lesser of two evils.

He has STG 3 valves, the head really wanted that 1.81 exhaust.

Springs are from TA, the replacment for the no longer available Vasco jet roller cam springs. Dual with a damper. Good spring pressures, 230 on the seat at 1.900 install height, and 625 at his .700 valve lift.

And he has titanium retainers, Mike just added those to his lineup.

JW

 

Jim
They supplied the spacers.....They also set up the sub-plates.
After seeing the installation,It will probably make more sense.

And I'm sure those "Stage 3" intake ports a bit wider than mine so that would explain the pushrod hole dilemma.
We modified the holes on my heads but it wasn't as extreme.

Studs were quite an odeal.....If I called ARP,They would probably hang up on me.It seemed to challange them a great deal to get my order right after I specified each stud length and how many I needed of each......They got it right..........The third time!

It was all worth in my mind,I wasn't pressed for time then and the extra work was worth it.

I wouldn't give up on them by any means,Maybe an upgrade for next winter.
Maybe you can get a look at mine before then.

 

Sleeving the head bolt???

OK Rick and Jim,

I gotta ask a question.... I see in one of the pictures that you have the head bolt between the two ports sleeved. I was going to do this to my cylinder heads but wussed out. So... here is my question... or questions...

1. How did you do it?
2. What did you use as the sleeve?
3. Are you afraid of crushing the cylinder head when you torque the head bolt?

I talked with Carl up at CFE Porting Service in Michigan about doing such a modification. He told me to go out and purchase new head studs for the studs that go between the ports. The studs on the Stg 2 are 1/2-17 (bottom), stud diameter is .500 with the top threads being 1/2-20. So I went out and purchased 4 studs that were 1/2-20 (bottom), stud diameter .437, and 7/16-20 top thread. Then I purchased some .563 od, .035 wall chrome molly tubing to put into the hole between the ports. Now... I was going to machine the hole between the ports from the top down but stop the hole about .900 from the bottom of the head. This way when the studs is clamped down on the chrome molly it will support the cylinder head from crushing. After the chrome molly tubing is installed you can open up that area of the cylinder head to the chrome molly tubing. Does this make sense? I am not afraid of doing this but I am afraid of crushing the cylinder head when you apply 100 ft lbs of torque. I say this because I thing Bruce (BQUICK) Wilson had some sort of issue like this. Bruce... if you read this please elaborate.

For all out there... I think this is a very good thread that should somehow be saved into the "thread favorites". There is a great deal of good positive information here.

Thanks

 

Gary

I haven't given up on the T&D's. With time not being a factor I will be researching further before making a final decision. One year without racing is far too much for me. I have to get back out there. I will bring them to Norwalk and I do want to check out your set-up closer. A winter project sounds do-able. Since Doug Hecker is beating up on me to throw out my ladder bar set-up and install a 4-link over the winter months. I think I may have no choice as the weak link may now be the rear suspension.

John

The tech stuff JW can answer but I attached a closer and yes Jim a clearer shot:grin: . Jim I was trying to consolidate multiple shots and reduced them unfortunately the clarity was lost when I did it. And yes Jim after spending the night with my heads:laugh: I finally re-bagged them and they will be at Robs very shortly.

Rick

 

a retake

Same shot clearer. JW the final should be mailed out to you by the tail of next week. Doug is happy now cause he is going ontop of the food chain now, for his roller cam:laugh: Unless Rob tries to bump him....

For those who don't know: I call it the "Food Chain" . Who ever is on top gets paid off first. :grin:

Rick

 

Ya.. that's better..

John, we will talk about the head bolt hole sleeving later.. got to get to the shop now..

I had my 1/2 day off.. back to work...

JW

PS.. Rick, if you get a chance, take a pic of one of the sleeved head bolt holes from the top, and post it.

JW

 

Those heads look killer guys:TU: Later in the season I may actually slap the moolah down to get a set. I'll have a 13 second convertible in no time:bglasses:

 

attached shot...
Rick

 

Yeah John, my concern is twofold.
1) crushing: I was torqueing my heads and suddenly one bolt moved with less resistance then tightened without problem. I was afraid I crushed the head. I wasn't even aware of the potential weakness at the time, so I wasn't looking for it.

2) inability to go beyond a certain level of porting without sleeving.

Bruce

 

I have a set of TA alum. stage one heads in the box that have a mild port job. I also had (sold) a set of 70 iron heads (stage 1)with Gessler stage 3 porting. See the floow numbers below:

Iron Heads: intake - 259. exhaust - 194.

Alum Heads: Intake - 314. exhaust - 216.

I hope this helps by e.t.'s and all of your questions.

ta