482, 494, or 500 plus C.I

Discussion in 'Race 400/430/455' started by bigdawg70, Apr 17, 2014.

  1. bigdawg70

    bigdawg70 1984 Buick Regal

    To the guys who have built them or thinking of doing it. If you could build another combo what would it be? I have been thinking of building another motor for my regal but I am undecided. I was wondering if its worth max cubes on a stock block. What are the pros and cons of them all? Is it really worth the price of the aftermarket cranks?
  2. Robsbuick

    Robsbuick Precision Billet Inc.

    If you want to go big, don't screw around with the iron crap. It is not a question of "if it will blow up" it's "when" imo
  3. bigdawg70

    bigdawg70 1984 Buick Regal

    I agree I was wondering if its a max that is considered safe. A new alum block is definitely not in the budget right now. I really would like to see more guys out with them before I consider that.
  4. mygs462

    mygs462 Well-Known Member

    It seems to me the 470 inch motor seems to be the latest thing in go fast motors. Im no expert but there are alot of guys with them and they are running WELL.
  5. Robsbuick

    Robsbuick Precision Billet Inc.

    I will let you know about the aluminium block. I will be installing one this weekend
  6. mygs462

    mygs462 Well-Known Member

    I built a 525 years ago and wound up selling it because the car never got finished, body shop prison. If I couldnt do the Aluminum block as I said above Id go 470.
  7. GS Kubisch

    GS Kubisch THE "CUT-UP" BUICK

    If nothing else...Get a steel crank.

    TA sells a few different Crower cranks.

    In my opinion/experience the billet steel crankshaft in my 505 is what's helped the engine live.
    The stock cast cranks flex and don't have as much of a chance against detonation.

    I used to worry about my engine but with "outside the Buick box" thinking on oil pressure and bearing clearances it's been good for a long time.

    4.350 bore is usually fine with a stock block...Then based on the rest of your combo pick a stroke.
  8. slimfromnz

    slimfromnz Kiwi Abroad

    Why is that?
  9. bigdawg70

    bigdawg70 1984 Buick Regal

    Thanks thats what I was told to do and build a similar 500ci . Im asking to learn. I have some great guys in the buick community I deal with. Im just seeing how the rest do it to learn. Hopefully I can make the best decision on my next setup.

    Bulldog blocks wasnt a good experience! I have seen a few but its still a learning process. With time comes experience and the block will only get better. The block isnt a cheap investment. I would like to see the blocks hold over time. I appreciate TA for stepping up, but for the price It makes me think of going to the bowtie with a tried and tested setup. For what my car is and does I have to look at the most practical investment.
  10. gmcgruther

    gmcgruther Well-Known Member

    There is something that really bothers me and no one person has answered my question or many others in here. what makes the 470 so much better then any other stroker? There is so many variables to consider like rod to crank ratio, piston to rod ratio, piston side load, bearing speed, piston speed? , amount of air needed to stroke ? , Amount of air needed to RPM use and so on. A dyno sheet or time slips don't mean nothing if the engine can't live past two years! I believe in longevity and having a decent amount of power to torque ratio. Please someone elaborate on this and give a good answer! A lot of people besides me want to know...
    Sincerely Gary M.
  11. gmcgruther

    gmcgruther Well-Known Member

    Here is my most wanted question, Which stroker engine has lasted the longest? I was going through several stroker combos that I could make, but have never done and one that stands out is 494 or anything above 475 C.I.D. You can go big bore small stroke to Small bore to big stroke! It all depends on the rpm's and longevity your lookin for!
  12. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

    Gary if you search the board and look over the stroker combos, particularly JW's stroker builds, the answers you seek and reasons why are clearly there.
  13. ap1672

    ap1672 Silver Level contributor

    Last edited: Jan 30, 2015
  14. 300sbb_overkill

    300sbb_overkill WWG1WGA. MAGA

  15. gmcgruther

    gmcgruther Well-Known Member

    I did do a search and still nothing about piston side load! At 1.775 pin height compared to any chevy, that's not to good! I ran several combos of rod lengths and I perfer the 7.000 " connecting rod and a pin height in the neighborhood of 1.500. This eliminates a ton of side load and a much lighter piston to boot. I'm still trying to figure out why everyone is using such big pin height for? I even contacted Ken Duiwittler ( spelled wrong ) he even said he perfers shorter pin heights over taller ones and Rod length actually helps you as long its not to long! That coming from a Buick V6 God, that there is priceless! Sincerely Gary M.
  16. Thumper (aka greatscat)

    Thumper (aka greatscat) Well-Known Member

    After doing many stroker motors , 470,482,and 494,what I found to be the ideal stroker combo with stock crank is a 482 with 7" R&R aluminum rods or Crower light weight 7" Nascar steel chevy rods. Venolia or Diamond light weight pistons at 1.5" compression height.
    The 482 still provides a a larger pin diameter and we've found they run as well as a 494.We've never broken a 494 but if the 482 is as good the 2.00" pin of the 494 makes me a little nervous over 6000rpm.
    Over 500" a steel crank with light weight components should also be used whenever a stock block is used.
    Our blocks are all girdled over 650hp and over 700hp a partial fill and girdle.
  17. bobc455

    bobc455 Well-Known Member

    My opinion is that when you are making a "compromise" motor (i.e. street + strip), then extra cubic inches will give you a bit of extra drivability with the extra torque (to keep the components less "racy").

    But if you are doing a race-only motor, then the extra cubic inches don't get you very much compared with other modifications (i.e. head porting, lighter-weight rotating components, etc.). Besides, to get a motor "bigger" you generally have to cut more steel (thinner cylinder walls, smaller crank journals, etc.) and this takes away from your overall strength & reliability.

    So for a car that isn't gonna see much time on the street, I'd stay small (if you can call 482 small) and focus on other places to get your HP.

    My advice is worth what you've paid for it...

  18. gmcgruther

    gmcgruther Well-Known Member

    Thank you gentleman , that's all I was wanting to know. I have always had problems getting a simple answer on here :( I will be using a block and main girdle to keep everything in check. My uncles goals are simple, atleast 750 hp and able to drive any where. That's why I asked a simple question on piston scuff, reliability , and everything else in between ! If I'm lucky he'll take this engine combo and put it in a 1964 Buick Skylark. He'll only maybe race it 12 times in a year :( but this is his baby and he wants his nephew ( me ) to build it ;) I accepted his challenge and heading in for the kill now.

    Sincerely Gary M.
  19. 300sbb_overkill

    300sbb_overkill WWG1WGA. MAGA

    You going too make that 750 HP with cast iron heads?

  20. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

    Gary, your questions on post # 15 are somewhat confusing, that's why you're not getting a direct answer.
    Just pick a build "recipe" and follow it. I wouldn't try to break new ground with a Buick until you've mastered a few builds along the way.
    Everyone that has is telling you the limitations you will see.

    Every brand application is different. You have different cylinder lengths and counterweight diameters. Gotta make sure the piston clears the crank and doesn't pull too far out the bottom of the cylinder on any stroker.
    The practicality of the build takes precedence over side loading or rod ratio.
    You can add more rod with a shorter skirt, but rod availability might be an issue.
    Piston scuffing is more of an concern with short rod, short skirted 2618 piston combos.
    Mountain motors run much shorter rod ratios than these Buicks.
    The +'s and -'s have been outlined in several threads.
    The more you read the stickies and other stroker threads, the more apparent the priorities surface.

    Post progress,
    Good luck. :)

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