IS this legit - AN "SS" stamping on a engine block with a casting # 1238861? SS I beleive is 1970 only (Stage 1) and 1238861 is a '71-'72 455 engine. Thanks for the input.
the engine code codes the specific year of the engine. a 71 Stage engine would be coded 'TS' and a 72 would be 'WS'. 1969 is 'RS'. this is a known certainty. the lists of casting numbers and the years the factory used them are a little more ... flaky. casting numbers are more a rule of thumb to get you into the general area of when the engine is from. it's also possible that you've got an engine assembled at the end of the 1970 production run that saw one of the 'new' 1238861 castings. we can't rule out a forgery at this point ... but you don't see many faked engine stampings. do you have the original factory carb? the Stage carb has a specific model number. we could also cross the casting numbers for the heads and intake.
Bob - the original carb is gone, now a Holley. Car invoice date is 9/23/69 - via Sloan, so it's a very early build rather than a late. The Sloan data all adds up to the car as it sits, but the casting #'s ahve thrown me. The "SS" stamp does look legit and not a forgery - but who know????? Thanks, Ross
That makes it dubious. You would expect that if it ever occurred to be on a June -July 1970 car. What is the date code on the deck surface? Also what is the casting date on the front of the block and on the intake manifold?
Looks like you need to purchase one of Duane's books and you will be an expert decoder like me....lol :laugh:
Hi guys - The only other marking I see is 1238864 - directly below the distributor, at the front of the block. Jim - how does the date code read (i.e. numeric or alpha?) - in what general area? It's all fun! Thanks Ross
That makes it dubious. Jim i believe you're placing far too much faith in the accuracy of the Casting application sheet. i've got the book that casting information was taken from and i KNOW for a fact that this would not be the only error in that book. some are far more serious than that. combine this with the fact that Gessler's intake and head casting list (i 'assume' Greg got his numbers from observation of engines in his shop) does NOT exactly conform to the Buicks.net list and i think i have 'reasonable doubt' about it's accuracy. there were also a couple of discrepancies with the list posted on AtlantaBuick.com but i don't think AB is back up yet. Ross you've got the entire car? well hell man, whyn't you say so? the last six digits of the car VIN should be stamped as part of the EIN (Engine Identification Number) also known as the engine serial number. http://www.buicks.net/shop/reference/engine_ident_where.html and yeah, get ahold of Duane. he knows how to decode all of the casting date codes so he'll be able to tell you if it was cast in the correct year.
Dont' see it - but will wipe more grime off. Intake is non-stock (TA). As to the casting dated code - can you lead me to a specific area - i.e. top/ bottom, right or left of the fly? Thanks, sorry for asking so many ?'s. Ross
Hi Ross - This Post may help you find the date code on the block. For your particular casting, you need to remove the intake. Good luck.
No VIN marking is there - that would ahve been too easy! It's been removed somewhere along the ways. The "SS" is there (buried under grime) where it should be. Marco - I looked at the location of your photo for the 3 digit casting date code - nothing there.. I did find this # - 42H924296?. Last digit unreadable and the last 6 is iffy too. This is small stamped numbers (1/16") - passenger side of block, front face of block, above oil pump, directly below where Marco's photo of the date code for casting is. Does this tell me anything? Back of engine / tranny bell housing area casting markings read 1238861, 455, and GM to the side. Thanks again guys, I'll stop here. Ross
Ross, I hate to tell you this but a "42H924296" block would be for a 1972 car built at the Flint production plant. That also explains why you have the late 71-72 engine casting number and why the date code is not cast into the front of the block, like they are on the 70 and early-mid 71 motors. Duane
I am right on the money. See Duane's post above. now that we've got the EIN, i concur. the only question now is whether or not the '924296' corresponds to the VIN of the car. if it doesn't match it's probably a bald-faced forging attempt. if it does match i would think that would imply a dealer service replacement, wouldn't it? it would be very odd for a 'forger' to go to all the trouble to restamp the entire block and then put the wrong year on it. :laugh:
Sorry Guys, but there is no way that is a replacement block. This block carries the numbers "42H924296" which means it is 4-Buick division 2-Year (1972) H-Flint 924296-Consecutive vin number which means it was taken out of a 72 Flint production car and installed into another car. Factory Service Replacement blocks use different numbering systems and have the numbers stamped at a different location. As to the "SS", maybe the motor was decked and put there by a rebuilder, who built it as a 70 Stage 1 performance level motor, to be installed in another car at a later date. I have seen all manner of factory "mistakes" on original engine blocks, where the vin number was 1 or 2 digits off but every date code was correct (they probably grabbed the wrong motor out of the rack), or where some used the wrong coded short block, like a 70 Stage 1 motor with a standard 455 short block. These types of "mistakes" are easy to tell and can be verified by date codes. The above differences are a whole different matter. Duane
And I can say that the block came out of a Riv. All Riv's, of this vintage, had their last 6 digits of the VIN begin with "9", ie: 9xxxxx. This also makes sense as all Riv's were Flint cars (again, of this vintage).
Brad, Thanks for adding the info about the rivs. I would have never thought about that because I do not track those cars. Duane
