I have raced Rob more than anyone and we both know how it will play out. I will out 60ft him by a mile and be ahead at half track and then we get in high gear and I start to check out my side mirror and I start seeing a yellow blur charging up and starting to get closer and closer untill 1319ft and the outcome will normally be won by a 1/4 fender by one of us, lately him :af: But when I raced the Camero out in E-town it was way different, we staged, at the green I left and by the 60ft mark it looked like I was just leaving the line. I thought I spun all the way thru first but my pile NEVER spins the tires, I didnt know what to think untill I got the timeslip :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: I was choped up and spit out by almost 7/10s. I guess Robs new exhaust will gain him 7/10s??? o No: I better watch out now!!! Jim
12secBee I know that nobody realy wants to be moved from a pure stocker to Fast but did you use a throtle stop to stay in the 12's you ran a 12.06 in stanton in 05 with a few more mile per hour than you ran in NJ in 45 degree air with everybody else running there best time ever.I saw in your 1/4 window the stickers that showed the progress you car has made over the last few years you have got it going faster and faster every year.It seems a bit odd that you were a bit slower when you should have been faster .You could always change your name to 11secBee .
Not to confuss this thread but, Gonzo's race does have differences that he allows with the engines. If you take advantage of all his rules you do get his 12.00 seconds and your out and moved up to FAST. I know that a guys claimed engine builder came on a website totally different and posted the build up with the results(it was a GM). The motor would not have passed Dan and Bob's race rules. Jim
Yeap, that is true.....and many of the Certified cars would be bounced by Gonzo. I think our cars are allowed more compression, but Gonzo lets you pick your own camshaft......
The motor used a longer rod, less intake duration and more exhaust duration. Thank you for clarifying my point. Jim :Comp:
Jim, do you remember where you saw that post ??? I looks like a Guest Visa program is going to have to be in effect for Martin....another headache for the FAST guys to worry From what I hear, some of the FAST cars from the e-town event may be coming to Martin, long with friends who have built cars for the Factory Stock race at E-town. whose rulebook will be used ?? I suppose someone should ask this question at the Year One site.....
Well, if the Martin folks want to drive people away they could adopt the Gonzo rules! o No: ou: Actually, Pete Simpson was put in charge of F/S by the Martin race organizers. He has specified the Pure Stock rules to be in effect. :TU:
First off, I would love to change my name to 11secBee if I could get it to go that fast with 225lbs behind the wheel. The car has officially ran 11.98 at Stanton with a "much lighter" Scott Tieman behind the wheel. I ran the 12.06 with me in it. I have certified the last 3 years and this year the rules were tightend and modified to only allow a "as delevered" valve job without any performance valves, as was allowed other years. This year only "OE Factory Replacement valves with NO NHRA modifications were allowed, so that is my "throttle stop" if you want to call it that. Also prior to the E-town event, I talked to Gonzo about what if I happend to get it in the 11s and he said it would be OK if I just touched the 11s, he didnt want to see any 11.80s or I would get bumped into FAST class. I drove 1300 miles to try to get it in the 11s with no such luck this year, after driving that far I wouldnt sandbag knowing that just being able to touch the 11s was allowed. I just couldnt do it!! :ball: Jim
I am not disagreeing with you Brian...... I guess I am thinking this needs to be settled before some poor guy hauls his "Factory Stocker" 1000 miles to be told "Well, at least you can participate in the BBQ" ...........
And I'm thinking you should leave well enough alone. Pete was made responsible ask him before you start another three page bitch fest about "why can't I run my car" and all the related crap. Been there done it, it's old. Leave it be. The F/S rules at Martin have been the same for a few years now, I guess people will need to learn to read.
Went over to the Year One site. ou: Too late. I guess I'll build a car for an NHRA event, then go to an IHRA one and wonder which rule book to use. o No: :laugh:
GONZO's rules can stay with GONZO. He wanted to change the ones that already existed. As for me and my heap, we're gonna abide by Pure Stock rules that we've adhered to for over 10 years. PS - Jim, I thought you had a plugged muffler or something else that was hampering the 'Bee ????
Here are the rules on the FAST website for Factory Stock: ENGINE Must be factory correct*. Original OEM blocks only, or OEM replacement blocks if they duplicate the correct* vintage block in design, material, appearance, size, weight and performance. Dealer installed engines and dealer performed modifications are not allowed. Cylinder heads, Intake and exhaust manifolds must be correct*, have correct* casting numbers and be of correct* material. Engine compartment must look factory correct*. Overbores up to .070 allowed. No light weight rods or pistons allowed. Stock cranks only. ( No strokers). Replacement forged pistons allowed. Engine torque strap OK. Note: Any Block, Head, Intake or Exhaust manifold that is not the correct* casting number, must be approved by the F.S coordiantor before a race. This will be applicable only if the part in question is the exact same, but was forged under a different casting number. Any OK`ed parts will receive a letter signed by the coordiantor. FUEL SYSTEM & CARBURETOR The carburetor and air filter housing assembly must be correct*. Mechanical secondary carbs cannot be substituted if vacuum operated units were original to the car. The stock mechanical fuel pump must be retained. No fuel pressure gauges are allowed. Carb choke assembly MUST be in place and functional. Factory fuel lines are required. No rubber lines allowed unless originally equipped as such. All qualifying and race runs must be done with the correct* air filter housing and an air filter in place. Carb spacers are not allowed. EXHAUST Cast iron exhaust manifolds are mandatory and must be correct*. No internal modification`s allowed (porting or extrude honing). Under no circumstances will headers be allowed, including those cars that had headers delivered in the trunk. Exhaust systems may be upgraded to a maximum of 2.5" diameter head and tail pipes. Pipes must exit in the correct* original location. Mufflers must be stock looking in design, that is oval in shape. Excessive exhaust leaks are not allowed. Certain Max Wedge cars left the factory with 3" inch head pipes, these cars can retain these head pipes up to, but not past, the transmission tail-shaft. Although equipped from the factory with cut-outs, all runs must be made with closed exhaust running through the mufflers. CAM AND VALVE TRAIN Valve Train: Valve covers must be correct*. No roller rockers. Rocker arm ratio must be correct*. Random requests for valve cover removal will happen. Adjustable rockers the same as stock ratio will be allowed, if not roller. Adjustable pushrods allowed. Poly-lock type adj nuts and crimp nuts allowed. Camshaft: MUST SOUND STOCK!!!-We all know what a STOCK cam sounds like! Camshaft must be STOCK, both in lift and duration for HP claimed. Engines must be able to produce 16.0 inches @ 1200rpm. Certain factory produced engines were not able to generate 16.0 inches of vacuum in showroom condition. Those cars will be given a variance on this rule. Factory Stock coordiantor will have final say on camshaft idle characteristics. Pulleys: All pulleys must be factory issue and be correct*. Belts running the water pump and alternator must be retained at all times. TIRES & WHEELS Wheels must be Factory correct*, including correct* diameter, width and offset. All 4 wheels and tires must be same size. Original equipment reproduction bias-ply tires and radials allowed, no soft compound tires of any kind are allowed. Retread tires are not allowed. If the correct* tire for your car was originally a 60 series, you may run a maximum tire size of G-60 or the equivalent size radial, all other cars may run a maximum tire size of G-70 or the equivalent size radial. which align nicely with the Pure Stock Rules......and are the rules that the Martin Race is run under so cars that run F/S at the e-town event may not be legal....... I spoke to the guy who was at E-town, and he and a few other F/S racers were interested in the Martin race, but were not sure what all the * meant, who to contact about their cars, yada yada yada.... just wanna make sure nothing has changed, and that Factory Stock cars that ran along side FAST car at E-town are not allowed to run along side FAST cars in Martin, before somone skips an event they would be welcome at, or worse, drives to an event to be DQ'd ...... I will stop posting in this thread, because this is not a pure Stock issue....I'll repost this at Year One and let the powers to be over there respond. Dave, will you please post a few obscure Olds pictures in this thread to change the subject :Brow: :Brow:
Casey, I had a Ultra-Flow muffler that had a tube in it brake loose and it was wipping around like a wet noodle. Jim
It's not a Pure Stock issue? The other participants in F/S at Martin aren't the same as Stanton? True statement on starting the derailment Donny.
I thought it was something like that Jim. Get that sucka fixed and we WILL have to change your name to 11SecBee ........ :3gears:
From Terry direct: NOTE: Throughout this rules document, all references to correct* acknowledge that it is proper for the year, make, model and horsepower claimed, for both the car and engine claimed. The car year, make, model, body style and engine combination must all have been produced and available to the general public in the year claimed, in an actual car. Copo Pete,the F/S tech guy uses the same rules as the PSMCDR,for the race at Martin,* means MUST BE correct. I now return you to the Oldsmobile photo gallery: Nice start on a yenko clone
