Discussion in 'Small Block Tech' started by Joe65SkylarkGS, Oct 27, 2009.
Beautiful! Nice job!!:TU:
Looks sorta similar to Tim Lanocha's Rover intakes.
I will have to google that name.
---------- Post added at 07:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:26 PM ----------
I will have to google that name.
:TU:All the info in here is great!! I want to thank all that contibuted to this thread.
That being said,I am in the process of collecting all the parts to build a around 10 to 1 NA 300 stroker. So far I have a set of nascar Carillo 6.2"rods,2.008 big end(witout bearings).900wide,bushed .867 small end. These rods were only used for dyno testing,if anyone is going this route,the dyno rods that I bought are like brand new! They came with the bearings that they used and they still look new, very minimum wear. This size(2.008) is the minimun size on the big end diamiter I would recomend buying. This build is for making as much torque as I can NA with this mill,so please,NO just put a turbo on it comments,or just build a 350,or 455 comments,thanks.This is going to be a 300 stroker.
With these rods,I have 4 options;
1)1.850" honda rod bearing journal without machining.
2)1.88" rod bearing without machining.
3)1.968 toyota rod bearing,with a 2.087 housing bore,machining required,.0395 per side removed from the OD.
4)2.00" Buick bearings,with a 2.125" housing bore,machining required,.0585 per side removed from OD,(this one being the least desired,being that the most material will be removed from OD,and may break through to the bolt hole,but still won't cause interferance,but may start weakening the rod.
I am set up in my garage to do the machining myself,machine the thickness down from .900 to .845,re-champher the crank side,after I decide on what big hole diameter I want,good to go.(custom pistons required of coarse)
Crank stroke options,3.70"-4.00",I'm leaning towards 3.90" stroke with the toyota bearing,but will consider the 4.00 stroke if someone has done this with a factory cast 350 crank and it lived.Any input on stroke size will be greatly appreciated.I will be having it ion nitrided,or some other kind of heat treat process(I'm not that far yet),and posibbly Eagles armor sheild process done?
As for the main journal size,I found 2.750" main bearing that should work by line boaring the block.I still need to investigate to make sure that I can still put a rear main seal in it. Input here would be helpful,and appreciated.More on the block later.
I will be having forged pistons made,I have been reading through the small block tech posts from the begining(that took a while,whoo)and it looks like Venoila(not sure I spelled this right) custom pistons look reasonablely priced if they are $65 a slug like I have seen posted,a conformation on that would be appreciated. I'm not going to use any kind of forced induction,or NOS,to try and keep costs down,as much as I can anyway.
I am considering the TA Rover heads,but they don't have any at this time,and the price on top of everything else make me want to explore other options at this time(but can be added later).I have a 64 complete engine with the aluminum heads,and considering some chop and weld to make them flow,changing some valve angles,maybe moving their locations,trying to stuff some 350 valves in them.This all depends on how good they take to being welded though(Franken heads LOL).Has anyone welded on these casting before? And if so,how did they take to it? Would like to stay with aluminum heads,because I already have them,and they will look stock in my 64 Skylark,and are lighter.
Not to many options here,I will have to make my own options. Am considering using a sbf intake with spacers,the spacers should be thick enough to merge the 2 center ports,the outer ones shouldn't be that bad,even the water ports can be merged even if I have to drill and tap the end for a pipe plug to get the water where it needs to go and still be able to use the thermostat housing(which is very similar to the Buick location). With the sbf 302 deck height of 8.2",and the sbb 300 deck height fo 9.543,the spacers should be quite thick. Just in the idea stage right now,only because I have a virgin dual quad sbf dual plane intake set up complete with carbs linkage and air cleaner ready to bolt on to something. Or, I'll have to see how well a stock al intake likes to be welded,or make a custom one. Still in the idea stage here,and would like to stay away from the Rover,and 215 stuff.(no offense to Rover and 215 fans,just don't want to go there with the intake).
I am thinking about putting in 4.00" ID sleeves,block filling to the water pump passages,and running an very large oil cooler.But that might be more work than I want to do,and expensive custum stepped sleeves would be required.LOL Would be SWEET to have a 401ci sbb though ,4.00" bore,3.990" stroke= 401ci. Probably will just take the bore out to 3.8". My line boring options(because I want to go with a 2.750"main journal on the crank for better overlap and strength) are to either line bore to the current centerline,or space the main caps down to increase deck height and cam clearance by as much as .250". But by doing this the front cover will need to be modified by lowering the crankshaft hole by .250",a .250" oilpan spacer,a .250" starter spacer,a longer timing chain,and an adapter for the rear of the motor to mount the transmission,I already know I am capable of doing all that was mentioned,but the rear main seal conundrum still needs to be investigated. And of coarse all of the sbb oil mods. The advantage to spacing the main caps would be less material would have to be taken out of the block,and off the caps,and it would be much easier to put the tang in the spacer than in the block,and more metal for the thrust bearing.
With the cold wheather on its way,and the classic car season coming to an end,and no heat in my garage(LOL)the machining process won't start until next spring,plus I only have 0ne 2 car garage that I use to store 2 of my cars in the winter .In the mean time I will be searching for a complete sbb 350 parts donor engine.
To be continued.............
Send me a Pm and I will help you out... Things like Merlim steel heads could help you out big time! Sean
Here is my official build thread: (Scroll down to the end of page one for the beginning of more up to date photos)
Overkill>> I had never seen that post before. That is an impressive undertaking. Spacing the crank down is a pretty neat idea. I thought about moving the cam up, but the lifter bores then become a problem. At any rate, spacing them apart more opens yourself up to more wild timing gear options, like off the shelf belt drives, etc... The SBB is approx 4.375" crank to cam, the SBC is 4.521", the BBC is 4.40", and the LSx is 4.885"
Thanks,I was thinking about doing that in case there isn't enough cam clearance with a 3.990 stroke. And just using the longer chain from what ever distance crank to cam I decided to space it too. That probably won't happen because its looking like it won't be an issue. With a billit crank,with an even longer stroke,this would have to be done for cam clearance. Another reason I was considering doing it was to use off the shelf pistons.
Thanks for the cam to crank dimensions,where did you get them from? Those dimensions are hard to come by. Here is a reference I use for other dimensions;
And talk about impressive!!!!!!! That intake is pretty dam sweet!!!!!!!!!!!! I have been jonesing to here how it runs on your engine combination. And I'm glad your friend is OK now,I was bummed to read about that.
Yes, we are all VERY happy that he's back! It was really touch and go for a while there.
I got the dimensions just by doing a google search fo "SBC cam to crank distance" then went and roughly measured the 300" in my garage which is the same for ALL SBB's and Buick v6's).
I think the deck height dimension for the v6 on that web page is wrong, as the v6 has the same piston compression height, rod length, and stroke as the 300, but they list the deck height as the same as the 340/350. There may be other discrepancies, so beware.
Thanks! We are going to do the modifications to the fuel tank and any other pieces that can be done separate from the car before hand so that once we get it in the shop it should be a shorter duration, as he has a bustling auto repair business and limited space. Hopefully this will be running on EFI before the new year.
I found a very useful article on the build-up of our Mighty 300's. Boys over at Hot Rod did it last year.
Some things got ugly over that article. The guys who built it and own it never came back. Can't have anything nice.
Anyone have anything to add here? There's good info here for the Mighty 300!!!!
Good Work,, You might consider the 5/7 swap, in a roller cam, as Jim suggested. What did final inlet radius, at the top of each runner , finish at ? Cheers, roverman.
Re 64 4bbl intake on 65 300.
I did this 12 years ago
With a mild poston cam
I didnt block cross overs or port match.
I think this may cause my issue of maybe boiling the gas out my carb making for a poor start later.
Seems I dump fuel in carb and it fires straight up
Could this be?
Thx for thoughts
Hello I put a 64 alm 4bbl intake and a mild poston cam on my 65 300
I didnt block the cross overs or port match
What would happen?
It seems to vapour lock occasionally or have evaporated the gas out of the carb causing hard starting
Starts right up when fuels dumped in carb
Thx for any insights
Hello ive had a 64 alm 4bbl intake for a few years. I didnt block cross overs or port. Didnt know that.
I think I evaporate the carb gas after runnin. Always hard starting. Unless I dump fuel in carb.
Would you think thats my issue?
That I should block crossovers?
Any advice appreciated
64 intake on 65 cast heads and intake.
MATT BIG and another have used 64 aluminum intake just gotta block exhaust cross overs and portmatch if that bothers you
So my question: ive done the swap
The gasket blocks 2 small squares and coolant passage from cast heads
Without port matching, do i have a performance choke going on?
Ive the poston 110 cam and 4bbl rochester
May throw turbo 350 and gears
Any help anyone?
Derek, Venolia make nice pistons but that price is the starting point, not the finished piston and you will almost certainly add to it. Everything you specify seems to be extra. By the time I was done with mine we were at about $700 IIRC.
Can't really comment on the '64/'65 intake swap, but if the gas is boiling out of the carb I'd sure consider blocking off the exhaust crossover.
Just curious, what spark plugs are being used with the aluminum head 300?
I recently made a deal for another 300 and found a usable 4bbl intake, so once the parts are gathered I plan to begin another build. May be awhile before I start but if the block checks out OK I'll start looking for a 350 crank to go in it. Then a forged piston and rod combo that will work with the TA-Rover heads, and top it all off with one of those 4bbl EFI packages. Plan for about a 7K redline.
Sounds like a lot of money, so I want to do everything I can reasonably do to keep the cost down. Sell off spare parts. Use NASCAR take out rods. See if I can come up with a rod that will let me use that Chevy 305 piston.
No hurry, I just thought I'd give you guys something more to chew on.